Ghosts?

[alteregoivy]

I have a question. Do any of you Atheists out there believe in ghosts and the supernatural?

I was honestly sort of flabbergasted when I heard from someone who was an Atheist and believed in these things. It just produces a "Does Not Compute" response in my brain.

So could anyone who does believe in these things explain how you can justify belief in the supernatural while rejecting beliefs in gods and religion?  

[Eccentric Detective]

Hehe. I personally believe in vampires.

Truth is, there's a gap between what we know and what we can only guess at. The supernatural sort of fills that. Religion almost does the same thing, but in a different way. I don't think I need to behave a certain way if vampires exist. Unless I fear for my life, XD.

But I don't suppose I'll believe in them if there's sufficient evidence against them. And I'm not hurting anybody, right? >_>  

[Le Pere Duchesne]

Atheism and materialism don't always go together. Just like all the people in another thread, here, talking about the afterlife...  

[Emerald Warrior Jewel]

I have a ghost. Percy hes very protective of me... and my dogs a werewolf... and my teachers is a vampires, shes been at my school since it was built... And my dads sasquatch...
I believe in it... and all of these are true... very true... Im not lieing...  

[In Search of a Dream]

I'm neutral on it. It would be cool if ghosts existed, but I think I have to see or feel them in order to believe they were actually out and about.

But I will admit that I love watching shows that investigate the paranorma. Those are so much fun to watch, regardless of the validity of the show's evidence and eye-witness accounts.  

[Arios V]

Neutral feelings really, although my dad's girlfriend did take a picture of a so called "Spirit Orb" one day. I actually saw the photo and looking at it, I really can't debunk it.

Also, don't say it was photoshopped/doctored. I was watching her take the photo and it appeared on the review screen on her camera.  

[Raticiel]

Atheism means you don't accept existence of god. So it doesn't counter ghosts at all. However rejecting a certain kind of religion, like one that allows the existence of souls, then you can't have ghosts. One of the popular atheism-converting factor is rejection of all supernatural stuff, and actually, if someone is an atheist and still claims that for example ghosts are out there, then how come this person can prove god's nonexistence? There's no reasonable way, at least I don't know of any. The key is to bear the consequences of the path you take.
And spiritual stuff is indeed fun to watch. rofl exorcisms are so funny, especially devil's voice is often simply killing me...  

[Captain_Shinzo]

As a Realist Humanist Atheist, I can't see how Atheists could believe in ghosts.
Atheists will usually look at the most truthful manner of evidence and such instead of believing of stories about a mansion being built by the dead ghosts of World War 2.
Ghosts usually mean spirits which leads to a soul. I believe we are meat puppets full of components keeping us alive. :
Does a soul pump my blood? Does it give me air? Does it help me think?

Now, there is the possibility of out-worldy actions but this is more scientifically and does not involve the soul but the waves of the brain itself.
Let's make an example of the disbelief of ghosts.

Someone took a handful of people and split them in two groups.
The first group that went into the abandon movie theater were told that it was haunted. They were seperated by the other group and did not speak with them.

The other group that went in were told they had a job on recreating this movie theater and making it active.
Guess who saw the ghosts?
Group one said that there was STRONG paranormal activity and that it was haunted without doubt.

Group two said nothing about ghosts and said it was a pretty peaceful place.
Imagine your house. Think of the difference of having lights and electronics with people.
Now take away people and electricity and all you have is a dark-as-night place where it is hard to see.
Aren't most ghostly tales based on this? A extremely dark place and they are told it is haunted before they freak out?
I rest my case.  

[Emerald Warrior Jewel]

Captain_Shinzo

Does a soul pump my blood? Does it give me air? Does it help me think?

No but it gives you humanity... and if you dont have that your not human... which leads me to believe in aliens...
Besides Percys hates you, you dont believe in him...  

[Captain_Shinzo]

Emerald Warrior Jewel

Captain_Shinzo

Does a soul pump my blood? Does it give me air? Does it help me think?

No but it gives you humanity... and if you dont have that your not human... which leads me to believe in aliens...
Besides Percys hates you, you dont believe in him...

Percys? Don't know him/her but I don't believe in the powers beyond the dead, sadly. >.> Just because I don't believe in Christians doesn't mean I should hate them or Vice-versa.
Humanity can only be described as.....What? You never told me what humanity is.
If a dog doesn't have Doginty does that NOT make him a dog?
Humans are what they are through their own intelligence and morals of the BRAIN. Not a soul. Aliens lead to souls? Don't tell me this is leading to Xenu...
Anyway, yeah. That is the point at hand.  

[Emerald Warrior Jewel]

[quote="Captain_Shinzo]Percys? Don't know him/her but I don't believe in the powers beyond the dead, sadly. >.> Just because I don't believe in Christians doesn't mean I should hate them or Vice-versa.
Humanity can only be described as.....What? You never told me what humanity is.
If a dog doesn't have Doginty does that NOT make him a dog?
Humans are what they are through their own intelligence and morals of the BRAIN. Not a soul. Aliens lead to souls? Don't tell me this is leading to Xenu...
Anyway, yeah. That is the point at hand.
Percy's my ghost... of course you dont know him.
I never said you should hate them... I never said that.
Humanity is being human. Seeing an old lady and helping her across the street... saving a little girl in a fire, doing things, in dont have humanity your a murderer, you dont care... your a vegitiable...
I said that... but its your heart that leads you... your gut, your instinct, your intelligence, thats all human, and that humanity, its not just the brain. otherwise the kids at my school could add 2+2 and = 4 since they cant this is disproven...
I never said Aliens lead to souls... I said, if your not human, your an alien, which means aliens exist.  

[Captain_Shinzo]

Emerald Warrior Jewel

[quote="Captain_Shinzo]Percys? Don't know him/her but I don't believe in the powers beyond the dead, sadly. >.> Just because I don't believe in Christians doesn't mean I should hate them or Vice-versa.
Humanity can only be described as.....What? You never told me what humanity is.
If a dog doesn't have Doginty does that NOT make him a dog?
Humans are what they are through their own intelligence and morals of the BRAIN. Not a soul. Aliens lead to souls? Don't tell me this is leading to Xenu...
Anyway, yeah. That is the point at hand.

Percy's my ghost... of course you dont know him.
I never said you should hate them... I never said that.
Humanity is being human. Seeing an old lady and helping her across the street... saving a little girl in a fire, doing things, in dont have humanity your a murderer, you dont care... your a vegitiable...
I said that... but its your heart that leads you... your gut, your instinct, your intelligence, thats all human, and that humanity, its not just the brain. otherwise the kids at my school could add 2+2 and = 4 since they cant this is disproven...
I never said Aliens lead to souls... I said, if your not human, your an alien, which means aliens exist.
That is all backwards logic, really. First off, Percys, you go to hell for not liking me. >:{
Continuing, humanity IS the brain because " humanity " comes from morals of that which you learn.
If you help an old lady cross the street, it is because you thought that she would have a problem crossing. Therefore, you wanted to help her cross. You don't need some fact name to tell you that you have morals.
Intelligence is the observation of the world and what you learned. If you can't answer something because you don't know it, that doesn't mean you have no intelligence. It means you haven't EXPLORED that topic.
Your heart doesn't lead you, it pumps your blood as I said. >.>
" Your heart leads you. " Is like a metaphor where the heart is describing your feelings of life. That is all and the heart does nothing else but keep your body moving.

Continuing, anything that is not human is an alien therefor aliens exist?
Backwards logic! That is like saying
" If something is not human, then it obviously goes to hell because it has no soul. " There is no evidence in that except a random claim. My cat must have flown down from a UFO then, I guess. We have NO proof that
" Aliens " exist. Also, if something isn't human that doesn't make it an alien, it makes it another species of the universe. You can't PROVE there are aliens out their just because YOU are a certain species because you made that name. If a cat could think, he could just as easily say that everything that was a cat was an alien if your claim was correct. Look up the definition of " Alien " so you know what it means, by the way, because I think you are way off course.

You mistake " humanity " with morals. Morals come from observations of your own world which means intelligence. Morals are different from people to people. Humanity is just a word meaning actions of a human, not GOOD ACTIONS. Besides, when have humans ever been " good "?
I see us doing more harm then " good ".

My point is:
A. Aliens can't be proven just because YOU are proven. It doesn't make sense and it shows that your vocabulary is slightly off.
B. You mistake a a metaphorical word with an actual word leading you to believe that an invisible essence inside you decides what you do and think. That is not the case nor will it ever be the case.
C. Your ghost has bad morals.
D. You said that your ghost hates me because I don't believe in him. This is my opinion. This is like saying I hate YOU for believing in ghosts. OF COURSE I don't but that is what it leads to. That comment I made was an example from my other reply incase you mistook it.

Bottom Line: You are confused on this topic.  

[Emerald Warrior Jewel]

Hes already in hell... he lives with me...
Im doing the V-DAY picture of a heart... not literaly...
Humanity, morals, flips sides of the same coin...
Sometimes they have, its the little things, not the big, that count.
I never mistaken that... ever... not once... I meant its you who decide ultimitly... not an essence... you... but theres something that makes you human, and thats why we're not beasts... or mindless Zombies...
My ghost is dead! He doesnt care!
I dont believe in ghost. I know ghosts!
Im not confused... Im confused about my math... but not about this topic.  

[B1g_crunch]

I believe ghosts exist as a trick of the mind for people who expect or desire supernatural phenomenon. Much of the brain is unknown, so it's plausible for nerve sensations (cold touch, goosebumps), as well as sights of "specral images".  

[Captain_Shinzo]

The problem I'm trying to get at is that the SAME can be with any-other animal. If a cat believes in Catinty, that means there is a force in him deciding what to do as a cat, when really, it is pure knowledge and instinct. Not Catinty. The only reason we are different from other animals is who we were made, not what we are made of.
As for us not being beasts, we are we different from animals?
We eat, we breath, we feel, we love, ect...
We ARE animals. Just different. Same goes for cats. Cats ARE animals, just different.
I got you there. You said YOU decide things. An organism is nothing without something to think with, meaning IT is the brain. If you say I make decisions, it's because of the brain. If I think I'm hungry, I will cook. To cook, I need to know how to cook and to know what to make is to know what exists.
Got you there again. You said MINDLESS zombies.
Are you implying the brain as a sort of decision and proving I am right?

Morals and humanity are very different, but the only difference is that morals actually exist while humanity is just a metaphor.

If you ghost didn't care, it wouldn't care about hating me now would he?
If your ghost is dead then why would he NOT care? What is the difference of humans and ghosts besides living?

You don't believe in ghosts yet you know ghosts?
Isn't that the same thing since you are saying that ghosts are real? ._.
A boy told me he got scratched on the arm by the black ghost and showed me his arm where the 4-5 scratches were.
Sure, they were there but that doesn't mean that is proof a ghost did it.
He was a special educated child with some anger issues. This means he could have just made it up about this " Black Ghost "
That and I can't remember kids going around to complete strangers showing how something made scratches on someones arm.

Confused about your math? Yet you just said your friends don't understand 2+2. Math is pretty easy if you ask me.
Yes, I imply you are confused because you are using personal opinions and nothing else.
Telling me you KNOW ghosts exists and telling me your beliefs wont explain to me how ghosts exists or the existence of your beliefs.
To some it down, your only telling me your beliefs and nothing else.


One more thing to repeat.
If your ghost doesn't care, then why would he hate me?
He must care if he wants to hate me. He could've just shrugged it off, told himself that he knows he exists. No, he had to go and TELL me he hates me. Showing he cares.

Going to my summary, I find this all useless if you can only tell me things and not explain it.
If you think telling me you have a ghost and that you know he exists and that he hates me because I don't believe is going to make me believe in ghosts then you obviously are nuts.
I am not going to believe in what people tell me. Ever.

It kinda makes it seem like your offended that I don't believe and say that Percys hates me because my ideals are opposite of yours.
However, that is just an assumption and I wont stoop to that.


My point is, morals of the brain because you learn it.
Humanity has nothing to do with the existence of humans nor does it make us different from animals. Animals are the same as us, we are just made differently.
I wont believe in ghosts just because you tell me that you know they exist and that your ghost buddy hates me yet he doesn't care about what I say because I am dead. Actually, that is contradiction right there considering you have to care to hate.
So there we go.

You are confused and I proved it.
If you want to DISPROVE me, then go ahead. But just telling me things exist because you know wont work. This isn't Christianity.