I have a question

[KirbyVictorious]

That was very, very interesting. o: ANd very deep, and well-thought-out. I think you're pretty much right anyway.  

[NovaKing]

lidless_i

I'd acctually prefer you refute it... that is if this were my thread and not Kirby's... Having an outside view contradict one's reasoning is a good way to improve it... or at least I think so.

I do as well, and in light of that I will proceed to do so. I may get yelled at though. Then again, it will be no more off topic then some of the other side conversation which riddles these threds, so I may be spared. Only time, and kirbs, will tell.  

[NovaKing]

lidless_i

Who am I living for?

Well, the most immediate answer that comes to mind is myself... but the grandiose, hopelessly unrealistic daydreams that I've had about hoisting humanity out of the pit in which (I perceive) it has securely lodged itself would beg to differ. Or at least make it so that the answer "Myself" is not enough to satisfy the entirety of it...

What are you living for?

I've tried so hard to figure this one out... Spending countless hours, that I should have spent sleeping, working out in my head. Finding solutions, comparing solutions found by others. The only problems is that none of them seem to hold up when you reason them down enough. Not a single God damned one. So, either I lack the capability to find the meaning of life (an entirely likely possibility) or there isn't one (it seems just as likely). So, if the second option is true, it makes some degree of sense to seek our own purpose, and find our own meaning for life. (Actually that doesn't make much sense at all, but when there is nothing else and it pleases the irrational parts of our brain to indulge, why not do so?) Of course, being the way that I am, I don't feel that any purpose I could assign life would be complete enough, or meaningful enough, to warrant that I follow through with it. So, for the moment, I'm not really living for anything...

I apologize for the rant there.

Why?

For both answers, because I can't find a logical reason to really do anything at all. At the most basic level that I can reason, none of the things that we fill our lives with make any sort of real sense. So, forgoing a well thought out reason for it all, why not satisfy the baser impulse that drives us forward in our daily lives? Not sex and food of course, but the base impulse that makes us want to have reason and purpose in our lives, even if it's fabricated. So... yeah... that's why, because logic fails beyond a certain depth, whereas impulsion (a real word?) doesn't seem to...

Sorry for the long winded lecture... thing...

Edit: looking at it in the actual post it doesn't look as long winded as it felt when writing it. As such I retract my apology. Meh.

It's nothing too major, it's just a few loops that one runs into when carring it further. You know now though, I'm not certain whether I can really refute what's in here....hmmm leme see.

Well firstly to say that you have concern for others is logically to say that you are vested in their well being becuase, in all simplicity, you like society and see it as a thing worth living with. Now this, however, is a vast assumption based on the fact that I think you are human and that I think you process things in a way fairly similarly to myself. Indeed it could be that you have some inner motivation that drives you to help people simply becuase you are concerned for all of them, but I doubt that very much - seeing as if you did you probably would be out there directly helping those in need, and not talking to me. This is not to say that we cannot be selfless, only that usually, so far as I know, we consider ourselves as part of the big picture.


Ispofacto, I have some reason to believe that you are in-fact living for yourself and that the others you speak of are simply part of a fabric which you enjoy as much as the next man. This is just a guess of logic though, and quite possibly not true.

oh well. This is just silly reasoning, you know. I hope you don't get mad at me if any of it is off the mark, and indeed I hope you correct me; for I may gain more that way.

Now logically there is no meaning of life; life is and that is all we can say about it. There is no proof to say that we have some sort of higher purpose, nor that there is any purpose to anything at all - none that I can see anyways. Notably this would be very boring, and humans give all they can meaning. Indeed, if we did not do so we would not have letters and numbers and so on. The things that humans make can mean things to other humans, just for the very fact that we are all human.

This being said, it follows that life means what we make it mean. This is fairly simple, and in my opinion quite sensible. This should not be what you concern yourself with though, for anyone can see that humans can make up their own reasons. Far more pressing a question then these reasons is why we choose our reasons.

There are many answers to these as well, but from what I've found, and in my own opinion, we continue on because we want happiness and love.

Those are the best two things I can think of and if nothing else, they are why I live and give reason to things.

It follows from this that I can think of two very good reasons for doing things. Whether other people see this though, is entirely up to them. Whether these people are right or wrong in ignoring me or giving me any heed at all, is a mystery to me.

~~~

Edit I: it seems that you move along the same lines without elaborating as much as I did (doing so in the "impulses" bit of your "why" statement. Ah well. Also, the only refuting I did was to the first section and even that may have been wrong.

Edit II: Basically, you do what you want. This, however, seems to be a far more troubling statement then the reason of life - from what I've seen anyways. ^_^

Edit III: I think my logic is far more cumbersome then yours.  

[KirbyVictorious]

Why doesn't everyone just shut up and pretend I don't exist? stare Never stopped anyone before.  

[NovaKing]

KirbyVictorious

Why doesn't everyone just shut up and pretend I don't exist? stare Never stopped anyone before.

Who said that?!

[ razz ]  

[BlackHawkGS]

KirbyVictorious

Why doesn't everyone just shut up and pretend I don't exist? stare Never stopped anyone before.

... what the hell was that?  

[NovaKing]

BlackHawkGS

KirbyVictorious

Why doesn't everyone just shut up and pretend I don't exist? stare Never stopped anyone before.

... what the hell was that?

I'm not sure....You know that thing where ducks dont make echoes when they quack? I think it was something like that....

weird...  

[Spastic waffles]

Who are you living for? God

What are you living for? Hmm...I dunno. Whatever purpose God put me here for, I guess.

Why? Because I have a purpose on this earth and I haven't fulfilled it yet.  

[NovaKing]

Spastic waffles

Who are you living for? God

What are you living for? Hmm...I dunno. Whatever purpose God put me here for, I guess.

Why? Because I have a purpose on this earth and I haven't fulfilled it yet.

what happens when you do fulfill it?

I mean, what if you purpose comes before death? what will you do withyourself after that?  

[KirbyVictorious]

That was me being emo, because after everything that's been happening, I think I deserve it. That and ice cream and DAMN my head hurts. X.x  

[Spastic waffles]

NovaKing

Spastic waffles

Who are you living for? God

What are you living for? Hmm...I dunno. Whatever purpose God put me here for, I guess.

Why? Because I have a purpose on this earth and I haven't fulfilled it yet.

what happens when you do fulfill it?

I mean, what if you purpose comes before death? what will you do withyourself after that?

I don't know, neccesarily, what my purpose is. But once God deems it time for me to die, I will die. I do know, however, that I won't die until I fulfil my purpose.  

[Galladonsfire]

man everyone in the guild came on today... eek  

[BlackHawkGS]

KirbyVictorious

That was me being emo, because after everything that's been happening, I think I deserve it. That and ice cream and DAMN my head hurts. X.x

... ok?  

[lidless_i]

NovaKing

lidless_i

Who am I living for?

Well, the most immediate answer that comes to mind is myself... but the grandiose, hopelessly unrealistic daydreams that I've had about hoisting humanity out of the pit in which (I perceive) it has securely lodged itself would beg to differ. Or at least make it so that the answer "Myself" is not enough to satisfy the entirety of it...

What are you living for?

I've tried so hard to figure this one out... Spending countless hours, that I should have spent sleeping, working out in my head. Finding solutions, comparing solutions found by others. The only problems is that none of them seem to hold up when you reason them down enough. Not a single God damned one. So, either I lack the capability to find the meaning of life (an entirely likely possibility) or there isn't one (it seems just as likely). So, if the second option is true, it makes some degree of sense to seek our own purpose, and find our own meaning for life. (Actually that doesn't make much sense at all, but when there is nothing else and it pleases the irrational parts of our brain to indulge, why not do so?) Of course, being the way that I am, I don't feel that any purpose I could assign life would be complete enough, or meaningful enough, to warrant that I follow through with it. So, for the moment, I'm not really living for anything...

I apologize for the rant there.

Why?

For both answers, because I can't find a logical reason to really do anything at all. At the most basic level that I can reason, none of the things that we fill our lives with make any sort of real sense. So, forgoing a well thought out reason for it all, why not satisfy the baser impulse that drives us forward in our daily lives? Not sex and food of course, but the base impulse that makes us want to have reason and purpose in our lives, even if it's fabricated. So... yeah... that's why, because logic fails beyond a certain depth, whereas impulsion (a real word?) doesn't seem to...

Sorry for the long winded lecture... thing...

Edit: looking at it in the actual post it doesn't look as long winded as it felt when writing it. As such I retract my apology. Meh.

It's nothing too major, it's just a few loops that one runs into when carring it further. You know now though, I'm not certain whether I can really refute what's in here....hmmm leme see.

Well firstly to say that you have concern for others is logically to say that you are vested in their well being becuase, in all simplicity, you like society and see it as a thing worth living with. Now this, however, is a vast assumption based on the fact that I think you are human and that I think you process things in a way fairly similarly to myself. Indeed it could be that you have some inner motivation that drives you to help people simply becuase you are concerned for all of them, but I doubt that very much - seeing as if you did you probably would be out there directly helping those in need, and not talking to me. This is not to say that we cannot be selfless, only that usually, so far as I know, we consider ourselves as part of the big picture.


Ispofacto, I have some reason to believe that you are in-fact living for yourself and that the others you speak of are simply part of a fabric which you enjoy as much as the next man. This is just a guess of logic though, and quite possibly not true.

oh well. This is just silly reasoning, you know. I hope you don't get mad at me if any of it is off the mark, and indeed I hope you correct me; for I may gain more that way.

Now logically there is no meaning of life; life is and that is all we can say about it. There is no proof to say that we have some sort of higher purpose, nor that there is any purpose to anything at all - none that I can see anyways. Notably this would be very boring, and humans give all they can meaning. Indeed, if we did not do so we would not have letters and numbers and so on. The things that humans make can mean things to other humans, just for the very fact that we are all human.

This being said, it follows that life means what we make it mean. This is fairly simple, and in my opinion quite sensible. This should not be what you concern yourself with though, for anyone can see that humans can make up their own reasons. Far more pressing a question then these reasons is why we choose our reasons.

There are many answers to these as well, but from what I've found, and in my own opinion, we continue on because we want happiness and love.

Those are the best two things I can think of and if nothing else, they are why I live and give reason to things.

It follows from this that I can think of two very good reasons for doing things. Whether other people see this though, is entirely up to them. Whether these people are right or wrong in ignoring me or giving me any heed at all, is a mystery to me.

~~~

Edit I: it seems that you move along the same lines without elaborating as much as I did (doing so in the "impulses" bit of your "why" statement. Ah well. Also, the only refuting I did was to the first section and even that may have been wrong.

Edit II: Basically, you do what you want. This, however, seems to be a far more troubling statement then the reason of life - from what I've seen anyways. ^_^

Edit III: I think my logic is far more cumbersome then yours.

Sorry for taking so long to reply (and for accidentally posting only the quoted part of this message at first in case you saw that before I fixed it...)
It hadn't acctually ever occurred to me, what you said in the first part. It's definitely something to consider... It makes a lot more sense than my way of looking at it anyway.
As for the rest of it, you are about right in saying that we were thinking along the same vein but you elaborated more. Where you said that we want happiness and love for example; when trying to find a reason for it all, I had thought that the pursuit of happiness was a viable goal, until I asked myself "Why happiness?" And I couldn't find any logical reason. The only thing that I had was that I enjoyed the emotion at a basic level, which doesn't seem to be a very good reason to me (unless you say that one should be allowed to pursue what they enjoy, in which case the line of logic loops forever, or until you run out of ways of saying "do what makes you happy because it makes you happy") So I began to look for a logical reason to live. Not a meaning of life, or at least I didn't really see it that way while looking, just something that I could devote my life to. Something supported by logic rather than impulses and emotion. It was there that I became dismayed, because, as (I think) I said, when we reason the things we live for down far enough, they lose meaning outside of emotion. So, the best answer that I could come up with was that, since there was no "real" reason to live, I would have to settle for something emotional. In other words, allow the absolute base motivations of my actions to remain emotional rather than trying to conjure logical ones. See?  

[KirbyVictorious]

MD: Nah, there's like 200-soemthing members total. All the regulars were though! ^^ Cept Oukow. ):

Hawkie: OK. Everyone gets to be emo sometime, right? Specially girls.

Lidless: Oh, Pudge, I forgot to warn you, doooonnn't argue with Nova! It gets ridiculous. X.x