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 Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 9:13 am
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Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:03 am
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dl1371 brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup Alright, let's set this scenario up.
You find yourself standing before God- the almighty, all-knowing being that you do not believe to exist. And you know that you have defied Him. And yet you still by some great fluke are accepted into Heaven. Eternity of bliss and love. Eternity. That's a really, really long time.
But instead, you would take it upon your very mortal self to criticize God. You would give all of that up to tell Him what a shitty job he's done with humanity and choose an eternity in Hell. Endless suffering. Endless torture. For eternity. That's forever. Forever and ever.
That's what you would do.
No.
Like most atheists who make that claim, you would probably piss yourself and beg for forgiveness. yeah, at first i might beg for forgiveness, but god's gonna send me to hell anyway for being an atheist, then since i knew i was going to hell, id give him something to rest on his conscience, and tell him what a shitty job hes done with the world also, i dont believe in eternities, so it wouldnt be endless suffering, at least as far as i believe, and what you find out, only matters when you're looking back
Somehow that doesn't sound as heroic. XD
I'm not trying to pick on you, I just think it's funny when people say they would pick Hell over Heaven to make a statement.
Pretty big talk for someone not standing, awe-struck, before his creator.if i believed in eternity then i would tell him off after i was condemned to hell, otherwise, no, you see, the whole idea is based off the idea that eternity doesnt exist, "i dont care if im burning in hell, in _____ years nothing that ever happened will matter also, what would you do if you were standing, awe-struck before Hitler if he was all powerful nowhere, its like being knocked out but you never come to just like what happens after you die i also think Lethkhar has a valid point, after a couple of years, or even days you would get used to it, i mean think about it, if you put your hand in cup of boiling water and you can't take it out, sure it'll hurt for a while, but after a couple minutes it'll stop hurting oh yeah, you never answered my question
I doubt that you get used to Hell. They've had a really really long time how to figure out how to make it as painful as possible.
And torture's pretty clever that way.
Do you know how a crucifix works? Why it's so painful?
When you're hanging there, eventually your hands go numb with pain. But your body collapses on itself in a way that makes it hard to breath.
By instinct, you try to push yourself up by pulling on your hands for a gasp of breath, but when you do all of the nerves in your hands start firing at once in an explosion of pain.
That's how you make torture effective.
And the question on Hitler? That's not a logical comparison.
A Christian would argue that God created us and has every right to destroy us.
Obviously I don't agree.
But it's more complicated than that.
But what would I do if I died to find that the Christian God exists?
This guy articulates how I feel about the idea better than I could.
Everything I've seen of Christianity is illogical. Designed to scare people into obedience and give them answers so they don't have to think.
So I would want to know how I was possibly wrong. How a just and loving God could be behind all of this. How there really is a reason for everything that happens.
That would concern me more than being an a*****e. |
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Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:04 am
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Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:06 pm
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brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup So you would tell God off only after you were condemned to Hell?
Somehow that doesn't sound as heroic. XD
I'm not trying to pick on you, I just think it's funny when people say they would pick Hell over Heaven to make a statement.
Pretty big talk for someone not standing, awe-struck, before his creator. if i believed in eternity then i would tell him off after i was condemned to hell, otherwise, no, you see, the whole idea is based off the idea that eternity doesnt exist, "i dont care if im burning in hell, in _____ years nothing that ever happened will matter also, what would you do if you were standing, awe-struck before Hitler if he was all powerful nowhere, its like being knocked out but you never come to just like what happens after you die i also think Lethkhar has a valid point, after a couple of years, or even days you would get used to it, i mean think about it, if you put your hand in cup of boiling water and you can't take it out, sure it'll hurt for a while, but after a couple minutes it'll stop hurting oh yeah, you never answered my question
I doubt that you get used to Hell. They've had a really really long time how to figure out how to make it as painful as possible.
And torture's pretty clever that way.
Do you know how a crucifix works? Why it's so painful?
When you're hanging there, eventually your hands go numb with pain. But your body collapses on itself in a way that makes it hard to breath.
By instinct, you try to push yourself up by pulling on your hands for a gasp of breath, but when you do all of the nerves in your hands start firing at once in an explosion of pain.
That's how you make torture effective.
And the question on Hitler? That's not a logical comparison.
A Christian would argue that God created us and has every right to destroy us.
Obviously I don't agree.
But it's more complicated than that.
But what would I do if I died to find that the Christian God exists?
This guy articulates how I feel about the idea better than I could.
Everything I've seen of Christianity is illogical. Designed to scare people into obedience and give them answers so they don't have to think.
So I would want to know how I was possibly wrong. How a just and loving God could be behind all of this. How there really is a reason for everything that happens.
That would concern me more than being an a*****e.
ah, but according to Dantes Inferno, which is the most accurate description of hell that Christians have, i would be sent to the sixth circle of flaming tombs, which i assume that i would get used to pretty quickly
also, the guy in the video was saying exactly what i was trying to say, except that i dont think god is all knowing because if he was, he would of realized that all of the bad things that have happened, would have happened, and he would of realized this at the moment he created the universe, therefore, if he is also benevolent, would have created a different universe, the only other thing i found flawed is that in Dantes Inferno, you can actually escape from hell, and there are some good fiction books about it(read Inferno and Escape From Hell) |
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Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 1:19 pm
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dl1371 brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup So you would tell God off only after you were condemned to Hell?
Somehow that doesn't sound as heroic. XD
I'm not trying to pick on you, I just think it's funny when people say they would pick Hell over Heaven to make a statement.
Pretty big talk for someone not standing, awe-struck, before his creator. if i believed in eternity then i would tell him off after i was condemned to hell, otherwise, no, you see, the whole idea is based off the idea that eternity doesnt exist, "i dont care if im burning in hell, in _____ years nothing that ever happened will matter also, what would you do if you were standing, awe-struck before Hitler if he was all powerful nowhere, its like being knocked out but you never come to just like what happens after you die i also think Lethkhar has a valid point, after a couple of years, or even days you would get used to it, i mean think about it, if you put your hand in cup of boiling water and you can't take it out, sure it'll hurt for a while, but after a couple minutes it'll stop hurting oh yeah, you never answered my question
I doubt that you get used to Hell. They've had a really really long time how to figure out how to make it as painful as possible.
And torture's pretty clever that way.
Do you know how a crucifix works? Why it's so painful?
When you're hanging there, eventually your hands go numb with pain. But your body collapses on itself in a way that makes it hard to breath.
By instinct, you try to push yourself up by pulling on your hands for a gasp of breath, but when you do all of the nerves in your hands start firing at once in an explosion of pain.
That's how you make torture effective.
And the question on Hitler? That's not a logical comparison.
A Christian would argue that God created us and has every right to destroy us.
Obviously I don't agree.
But it's more complicated than that.
But what would I do if I died to find that the Christian God exists?
This guy articulates how I feel about the idea better than I could.
Everything I've seen of Christianity is illogical. Designed to scare people into obedience and give them answers so they don't have to think.
So I would want to know how I was possibly wrong. How a just and loving God could be behind all of this. How there really is a reason for everything that happens.
That would concern me more than being an a*****e.ah, but according to Dantes Inferno, which is the most accurate description of hell that Christians have, i would be sent to the sixth circle of flaming tombs, which i assume that i would get used to pretty quickly also, the guy in the video was saying exactly what i was trying to say, except that i dont think god is all knowing because if he was, he would of realized that all of the bad things that have happened, would have happened, and he would of realized this at the moment he created the universe, therefore, if he is also benevolent, would have created a different universe, the only other thing i found flawed is that in Dantes Inferno, you can actually escape from hell, and there are some good fiction books about it(read Inferno and Escape From Hell)
One that is not consistent with the idea of Hell in modern Christianity as I understand it.
And yes, that's why many of us are atheists.
Logically no loving God would be so cruel to His creations, killing them without remorse, condemning most of them to Hell simply because they didn't find Him.
But assuming that Christianity is right about God, Heaven, and Hell... |
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Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 1:28 pm
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brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup dl1371 brainnsoup If eternity doesn't exist, then where do you expect to go after Hell? Back to Heaven? Because that would be pretty awkward nowhere, its like being knocked out but you never come to just like what happens after you die i also think Lethkhar has a valid point, after a couple of years, or even days you would get used to it, i mean think about it, if you put your hand in cup of boiling water and you can't take it out, sure it'll hurt for a while, but after a couple minutes it'll stop hurting oh yeah, you never answered my question
I doubt that you get used to Hell. They've had a really really long time how to figure out how to make it as painful as possible.
And torture's pretty clever that way.
Do you know how a crucifix works? Why it's so painful?
When you're hanging there, eventually your hands go numb with pain. But your body collapses on itself in a way that makes it hard to breath.
By instinct, you try to push yourself up by pulling on your hands for a gasp of breath, but when you do all of the nerves in your hands start firing at once in an explosion of pain.
That's how you make torture effective.
And the question on Hitler? That's not a logical comparison.
A Christian would argue that God created us and has every right to destroy us.
Obviously I don't agree.
But it's more complicated than that.
But what would I do if I died to find that the Christian God exists?
This guy articulates how I feel about the idea better than I could.
Everything I've seen of Christianity is illogical. Designed to scare people into obedience and give them answers so they don't have to think.
So I would want to know how I was possibly wrong. How a just and loving God could be behind all of this. How there really is a reason for everything that happens.
That would concern me more than being an a*****e.ah, but according to Dantes Inferno, which is the most accurate description of hell that Christians have, i would be sent to the sixth circle of flaming tombs, which i assume that i would get used to pretty quickly also, the guy in the video was saying exactly what i was trying to say, except that i dont think god is all knowing because if he was, he would of realized that all of the bad things that have happened, would have happened, and he would of realized this at the moment he created the universe, therefore, if he is also benevolent, would have created a different universe, the only other thing i found flawed is that in Dantes Inferno, you can actually escape from hell, and there are some good fiction books about it(read Inferno and Escape From Hell)
One that is not consistent with the idea of Hell in modern Christianity as I understand it.
And yes, that's why many of us are atheists.
Logically no loving God would be so cruel to His creations, killing them without remorse, condemning most of them to Hell simply because they didn't find Him.
But assuming that Christianity is right about God, Heaven, and Hell...
yes, but i assume that if any type of Christianity is right, it certaintly isn't modern Christianity
also, i see your point that no loving god would be so cruel to his creations |
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Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 2:58 pm
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Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:25 pm
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Lethkhar brainnsoup A Christian would argue that God created us and has every right to destroy us. "If God takes life he's an indian giver." Sorry, just love that Modest Mouse line. xd Your example with the crucifix isn't totally valid. I mean, you die after a few days on the crucifix. I'll bet that after the first few years it just wouldn't mean as much anymore. It's human nature to grow accustomed to things like that. Eventually, even your hands would heal around the stakes (Assuming they didn't get infected and kill you) Though I guess if the guy doing it is all-powerful, he could probably keep us from getting used to it. Don't know how you'd reconcile that with free will, though... The truth of the matter is I'm not scared of that, because in order for Hell to truly be infinite torture you'd have to overcome a lot of weird illogical issues like that. Hell, I'd probably be too busy trying to figure out all of the paradoxes I was involved in to actually get the full Hell experience.
But that reminds me of Psych. XD
But that's the thing! You can't die in Hell. You can't pass out from the pain.
If you're completely on fire in real life, you pass out from the pain first. Then you die. In Hell, you would have to feel all of the pain.
And yes, if you keep feeling pain in the same spot, eventually you will get so used to it that you wouldn't notice.
But then again, it's your soul that's being tortured, not your physical body.
So who knows.
But if Hell did exists it would be designed to cause immense suffering. (By the will of a loving God, no?) I'm sure you don't simply get used to the pain.
Also, the whole idea of God giving us free will is complete bullshit. He gave us free will so that we are not His mindless slaves. But if we use that free will and act as anything but His mindless slaves- even by accident- then we are damned to Hell forever and ever?
Yeah, He did that because He loves us. That makes sense. That's not something else designed by the church to save Christians from, you know, thinking.
Oh, I'm 100% sure that Christians are wrong about the afterlife.
As you said, too many paradoxes. Too many logical fallacies.
This is purely hypothetical. |
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Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 6:58 pm
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Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 7:58 pm
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Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 8:36 pm
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Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 10:24 pm
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Dark Lord Erebus brainnsoup Dark Lord Erebus If i had a choice or not I'd flip god off then jump into hell, I only want to go to hell to meet all the amazing people that the christians condemned and I also get a sick (absolutely GREAT!) feeling from feeling pain.
You would grovel like a dog trying to win back the favor of its master.how would you know, anyway i'm like a cat if you mistreat me once i can't nor will ever look upon you the same. You say that because i'm human i'm meant to be scared at a woos of a god who just wants people to believe. If he's so bent on forgiveness and keeping his word then he should look at what his job is while i keep mine of denying anything greater then the universe can possibly be.
Nor that it doesn't logically make sense for a loving, forgiving God to remorselessly send His beloved creations to suffer for eternity.
But first of all, to say with such certainty what your exact actions would be if you were face to face with your creator, this almighty, all-powerful being that you did not until now believe to exist, is ridiculous.
Factor in the fact that you believed that this meant that you were about to face eternity of unfathomable torture, and I highly doubt you would be so brave. |
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Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 12:35 am
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brainnsoup Dark Lord Erebus brainnsoup Dark Lord Erebus If i had a choice or not I'd flip god off then jump into hell, I only want to go to hell to meet all the amazing people that the christians condemned and I also get a sick (absolutely GREAT!) feeling from feeling pain.
You would grovel like a dog trying to win back the favor of its master.how would you know, anyway i'm like a cat if you mistreat me once i can't nor will ever look upon you the same. You say that because i'm human i'm meant to be scared at a woos of a god who just wants people to believe. If he's so bent on forgiveness and keeping his word then he should look at what his job is while i keep mine of denying anything greater then the universe can possibly be.
Nor that it doesn't logically make sense for a loving, forgiving God to remorselessly send His beloved creations to suffer for eternity.
But first of all, to say with such certainty what your exact actions would be if you were face to face with your creator, this almighty, all-powerful being that you did not until now believe to exist, is ridiculous.
Factor in the fact that you believed that this meant that you were about to face eternity of unfathomable torture, and I highly doubt you would be so brave.
Yeah, I'd probably chicken out. But if he's omniscient, it wouldn't make a difference. I can't help what I think. And I would certainly be thinking some pretty nasty things. |
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Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:18 am
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Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 12:04 pm
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