Underage magicians

[Loagaeth]

I think it's very personal. Like a few others on here have said, I think it depends on how far along the person is. I know a lot of people who I wouldn't teach anything to if they were in their 40's, but then again, I am a salty old hermit that only enjoys the company of my dry old books! *shakes fist*  

[Baltazaar]

I have no problem with teaching someone who really seeks the answer to his problems over the net. Each time you do not offer help for those who ask for it, you will be accounted. And if the kid does some things wrong, it will not kill him if he is any smart. if it does, I told him the riscs. And besides, if you have nothing to get your fancy magic, as you call it, from, you will not be able to do anything...  

[Atticus Lock]

For me I don't care about age, sex, race, ect. All that I ask for is a will to learn.  

[kpelli]

I dont know how to reply to this....I would rather met the person in person if at all possible. And I say this because you can "read" what type of individual they are. By this I mean are they into this as a fad? For nefarious purposes? Are they unstable? Im pretty good at reading a person that I can see physically in person..Then if things go right I would not have a problem teaching anyone (not that I could by the way) as long as they are willing to learn.

Makes no sense sorry

The Fearless One  

[Reinos_beloved]

Dude, I'm an under age and I'm teaching three or four others who are also underage  

[Elfshaman]

Reinos_beloved

Dude, I'm an under age and I'm teaching three or four others who are also underage

same here. i'm only seventeen but i've been studying magic for six years.depends on the person  

[drk phinx]

ohh it's underage people "online" ok, well that's a horse of a different color. Yes, i think it's better to teach underage people online, especially if their parents disapproves of exploring new things in life. It's hard to find a group that's into occultism, especially in rural areas away from big cities. Because of this lovely internet invention, it makes people more open and aware of occult studies, and people who are practicing won't have to be persecuted for their beliefs. I'm not underage anymore, but i remember how it was in grade school trying to learn Wicca, and basic circle casting and LBRP on my own while in Catholic school LOL.

*sighs* my life in a nut shell, part of it at least. lol  

[Deadly Nonchalance]

I believe it depends on if the person seems ready to learn. If they really want to learn it then they should be able too.
i have to agree with the person ahead of me too. In rural area's it's hard to find people that are into the same things as you.  

[Saeiane Kveldulfr]

This is a very interesting question, and a potential minefield of discussion.
As I started learning about the occult (Celtic Witchcraft to be precise. Currently I classify myself as a Shamanistic Witch) at age 10, and I one day wish to teach my children about it, I do feel teaching at a young age is appropriate. However this is not the kind of question that can be answered with a simple yes or no, one must take into account all aspects of the child and his or her life- the first step of which is (as a lot of you have mentioned) talking to their parents (Although in the case of parents who take a highly "conservative" approach to things- it may be best to let the child decide. Depending on their age and maturity)

If a child is impressionable, foolish, and jumps from one thing to the next faster than a grasshopper to a leaf... Well, I'd just give them some food for thought, moral views, questions about "why", etc. Test their actual focus- but I doubt I would teach the child until I was sure that they were able to dedicate themselves.

Another metaphorical battlefield is teaching online. Same problems and procedure, but one large difficulty- the medium. Forum, chatroom, IM, email, etc. These all have their specific pluses and minuses. But one big problem is: How do you really gauge them. This isn't all too much of a problem for me, as I have adapted my techniques to be able to read people even from emails written years ago. One can still be fooled however, I remember a bad period in my life where I accidentally let a highly parasitic person a tad bit too close for comfort.

I'm currently "teaching" a person who has highly conservative parents, who sheltered her for quite a while and- in my eyes- damaged her. Yet she still has amazing natural talent (which makes me wonder how powerful she would be if she had an upbringing like mine. Dear gods.), her only problem is she still lives with them (she's not underage) and is highly restricted. Even if she WAS underage, I would still try to teach her- because she deserves a chance, and it makes me quite sad to see natural talent beaten out of a person by cynics and misguided people. My point here being, when in doubt; weigh the circumstances over and over until you come to a conclusion. It's easier than it sounds.

I apologize for the VERY long ramble... It's a bad habit of mine.
~Saeiane Kveldulfr, The Warrior Priest.  

[Chieftain Twilight]

personally, i have rarely gained anything good from studying the Occult, and it seems like it always costs more and more and more, never for anything worthe the costs... and those costs seem to be cummulative...

anywho, i have a, uh... let's call him a friend.... who is quite obsessed with the Occult. quite frankly, he's completely off his rocker! that much is fine with me as long as he's fine with it, but he's also very unstable. i have seen what his research has done to him.

for the longest time the ONLY thing he has cared about is the pursuit of ever more knowledge (and caring for people he loves when he can). he put that goal (the goal of knowing everything, and of becomming a god) even above permanent romantic relationships. he didn't care if he lived or died, didn't want to be married (still wanted more kids, and had 6 of his own, 4 of which were motherless). he just wanted to keep learning, and he lived very much alone.

well, when he DID fall in love for the second time, he still had his obsessions... they caused some very serious problems, and ruined his love life. and he still didn't get the knowledge he wanted. i dunno where he stands about that right now anymore, but i know he is currently focusing on something else.

my point is, the Occult is not worthe it in my opinion. i wouldn't suggest ANYONE study it... and i wouldn't teach it to anyone.  

[Saeiane Kveldulfr]

Twilight Cheiftain:
I would have to disagree, I mean, I can't speak for your experiences obviously; but if I counted only the bad things that I can relate to the occult that have happened in my life... The good things would still outweigh them (that is to say, everything that at the time seemed "Bad" I later found had a purpose, or something to teach me from the experience).

I will admit to having my little problems and quirks (You should see me when I'm deep in a train of thought, I babble on like a madman.), but what person doesn't, really. They're more character flaws than anything. If I didn't love it, and love all the good things it brought (and still brings) in to my life, I'd have stopped a long time ago. I won't say that it is for everyone, obviously, there are a lot of frightening and challenging things that have happened to me that could damage a person who was not ready for them, but personally, by me going through them, I have grown as a person.
Best wishes for you and your friend though, it's sad to see a persons life be taken over by any kind of obsession.

 

[Underworld Priestess]

I think underage teaching underage is okay as long as both parties are willing to learn. As for an older person teaching a younger person, I think as long as there is maturity and respect and a willingness to learn and the parents are okay with it it is okay. I just have this mental picture of angry parents chasing someone away with pitchforks and fire.

But if its like a 40 year old and a fifteen year old it starts to verge on creepy.  

[Chieftain Twilight]

Saeiane Kveldulfr

Twilight Cheiftain:
I would have to disagree, I mean, I can't speak for your experiences obviously; but if I counted only the bad things that I can relate to the occult that have happened in my life... The good things would still outweigh them (that is to say, everything that at the time seemed "Bad" I later found had a purpose, or something to teach me from the experience).

I will admit to having my little problems and quirks (You should see me when I'm deep in a train of thought, I babble on like a madman.), but what person doesn't, really. They're more character flaws than anything. If I didn't love it, and love all the good things it brought (and still brings) in to my life, I'd have stopped a long time ago. I won't say that it is for everyone, obviously, there are a lot of frightening and challenging things that have happened to me that could damage a person who was not ready for them, but personally, by me going through them, I have grown as a person.
Best wishes for you and your friend though, it's sad to see a persons life be taken over by any kind of obsession.

tell me, what madness do you babble? have you ever had hysteric fits where you were completely thoughtless and insane? simply performing some violent action over and over? maybe attempting to single-mindedly kill whoever you saw, or perhaps running straight forward into a solid object roaring a the top of your lungs, or maybe just screaming in pain and terror spontaneously, or perhaps crying or laughing for upwards of half an hour.... maybe you become obsessively compulsed temporarily with punching glass, or maybe you mumble nonsensical sentences or even gibberish nonstop no matter what anyone says.

have you ever inexplicably pretended you were someone else, and then forget you did later? have you ever had an actual personality change complete with selective memory? what about night terrors, halluscinations of every sense from sights to sounds to touches? or waking up at exactly 2:10 am every night, abl to see and think but not stop yourself from grabbing a razor blade and walking to the bathroom, unable to control your own body but still able to watch, as you cut and carve words of hatred or guilt into your own arm?

i've been in mental wards, i've been in juvie, i could go to jail any day now. or worse, a prison for the criminally insane, maybe even deathrow. i have quadruplets, that i'm technically not allowed to have. if sydney gets them she'll just put them up for adoption again, if she calls the cops i could go to jail for kidnapping, if she brings it to court i could never see them again. according to the state, i am not fit to be a parent. but i want my kids and she doesn't. she just doesn't want me to have them.

i might never marry, because the one person who accepted me and my madness cannot accept me if i change again like i did. i have to prove that i can at least have a stable personality. it isn't my madness that she cannot accept, or my fetishes... it is the danger i could pose if i stop caring, even for a minute, about her fealings or the feelings of, oh say, her daughter (who i was so looking forward to being the stepdad of). you want to talk about madness, and the danger posed to one's own life that the Occult brings, well try that on for size.  

[Rustig]

Chieftain Twilight

Saeiane Kveldulfr

Twilight Cheiftain:
I would have to disagree, I mean, I can't speak for your experiences obviously; but if I counted only the bad things that I can relate to the occult that have happened in my life... The good things would still outweigh them (that is to say, everything that at the time seemed "Bad" I later found had a purpose, or something to teach me from the experience).

I will admit to having my little problems and quirks (You should see me when I'm deep in a train of thought, I babble on like a madman.), but what person doesn't, really. They're more character flaws than anything. If I didn't love it, and love all the good things it brought (and still brings) in to my life, I'd have stopped a long time ago. I won't say that it is for everyone, obviously, there are a lot of frightening and challenging things that have happened to me that could damage a person who was not ready for them, but personally, by me going through them, I have grown as a person.
Best wishes for you and your friend though, it's sad to see a persons life be taken over by any kind of obsession.

tell me, what madness do you babble? have you ever had hysteric fits where you were completely thoughtless and insane? simply performing some violent action over and over? maybe attempting to single-mindedly kill whoever you saw, or perhaps running straight forward into a solid object roaring a the top of your lungs, or maybe just screaming in pain and terror spontaneously, or perhaps crying or laughing for upwards of half an hour.... maybe you become obsessively compulsed temporarily with punching glass, or maybe you mumble nonsensical sentences or even gibberish nonstop no matter what anyone says.

have you ever inexplicably pretended you were someone else, and then forget you did later? have you ever had an actual personality change complete with selective memory? what about night terrors, halluscinations of every sense from sights to sounds to touches? or waking up at exactly 2:10 am every night, abl to see and think but not stop yourself from grabbing a razor blade and walking to the bathroom, unable to control your own body but still able to watch, as you cut and carve words of hatred or guilt into your own arm?

i've been in mental wards, i've been in juvie, i could go to jail any day now. or worse, a prison for the criminally insane, maybe even deathrow. i have quadruplets, that i'm technically not allowed to have. if sydney gets them she'll just put them up for adoption again, if she calls the cops i could go to jail for kidnapping, if she brings it to court i could never see them again. according to the state, i am not fit to be a parent. but i want my kids and she doesn't. she just doesn't want me to have them.

i might never marry, because the one person who accepted me and my madness cannot accept me if i change again like i did. i have to prove that i can at least have a stable personality. it isn't my madness that she cannot accept, or my fetishes... it is the danger i could pose if i stop caring, even for a minute, about her fealings or the feelings of, oh say, her daughter (who i was so looking forward to being the stepdad of). you want to talk about madness, and the danger posed to one's own life that the Occult brings, well try that on for size.

Given that you and Saeiane have had vastly different experiences with the occult, I'd say there are other extenuating circumstances that've generated the various tragedies in your life - after all, not everyone involved in the occult has to go to a crisis stabilisation unit, so either you must be the next Aleister Crowley, whose magickal exploits will fuel the imaginations of the next generation, or there's something else wrong that the occult just didn't mesh with. I don't mean to sound callous, but Saeiane didn't mean anything bad by what he said, and you follow up with a post that virtually flaunts your various tragic experiences - I've no patience for folk who wield the bad events in their life like weapons.

And besides, how can you go to jail for kidnapping astral thoughtform-babies?  

[Chieftain Twilight]

Mitsh

Chieftain Twilight

Saeiane Kveldulfr

Twilight Cheiftain:
I would have to disagree, I mean, I can't speak for your experiences obviously; but if I counted only the bad things that I can relate to the occult that have happened in my life... The good things would still outweigh them (that is to say, everything that at the time seemed "Bad" I later found had a purpose, or something to teach me from the experience).

I will admit to having my little problems and quirks (You should see me when I'm deep in a train of thought, I babble on like a madman.), but what person doesn't, really. They're more character flaws than anything. If I didn't love it, and love all the good things it brought (and still brings) in to my life, I'd have stopped a long time ago. I won't say that it is for everyone, obviously, there are a lot of frightening and challenging things that have happened to me that could damage a person who was not ready for them, but personally, by me going through them, I have grown as a person.
Best wishes for you and your friend though, it's sad to see a persons life be taken over by any kind of obsession.

tell me, what madness do you babble? have you ever had hysteric fits where you were completely thoughtless and insane? simply performing some violent action over and over? maybe attempting to single-mindedly kill whoever you saw, or perhaps running straight forward into a solid object roaring a the top of your lungs, or maybe just screaming in pain and terror spontaneously, or perhaps crying or laughing for upwards of half an hour.... maybe you become obsessively compulsed temporarily with punching glass, or maybe you mumble nonsensical sentences or even gibberish nonstop no matter what anyone says.

have you ever inexplicably pretended you were someone else, and then forget you did later? have you ever had an actual personality change complete with selective memory? what about night terrors, halluscinations of every sense from sights to sounds to touches? or waking up at exactly 2:10 am every night, abl to see and think but not stop yourself from grabbing a razor blade and walking to the bathroom, unable to control your own body but still able to watch, as you cut and carve words of hatred or guilt into your own arm?

i've been in mental wards, i've been in juvie, i could go to jail any day now. or worse, a prison for the criminally insane, maybe even deathrow. i have quadruplets, that i'm technically not allowed to have. if sydney gets them she'll just put them up for adoption again, if she calls the cops i could go to jail for kidnapping, if she brings it to court i could never see them again. according to the state, i am not fit to be a parent. but i want my kids and she doesn't. she just doesn't want me to have them.

i might never marry, because the one person who accepted me and my madness cannot accept me if i change again like i did. i have to prove that i can at least have a stable personality. it isn't my madness that she cannot accept, or my fetishes... it is the danger i could pose if i stop caring, even for a minute, about her fealings or the feelings of, oh say, her daughter (who i was so looking forward to being the stepdad of). you want to talk about madness, and the danger posed to one's own life that the Occult brings, well try that on for size.

Given that you and Saeiane have had vastly different experiences with the occult, I'd say there are other extenuating circumstances that've generated the various tragedies in your life - after all, not everyone involved in the occult has to go to a crisis stabilisation unit, so either you must be the next Aleister Crowley, whose magickal exploits will fuel the imaginations of the next generation, or there's something else wrong that the occult just didn't mesh with. I don't mean to sound callous, but Saeiane didn't mean anything bad by what he said, and you follow up with a post that virtually flaunts your various tragic experiences - I've no patience for folk who wield the bad events in their life like weapons.

And besides, how can you go to jail for kidnapping astral thoughtform-babies?

ah, you caught me continuing a growing lie i made to avoid bringing up the Occult around certain people... no, i won't go to jail, i have a similarly severe conflict involving them, but see since i told certain people that the children were real the story had to grow.

anywho, i appologize, truely, i didn't mean to get so worked up and overexcited, and it certainly wasn't my intention to exude hostility like that. i was speaking rather agressively, wasnt i... sorry again Sae and Mitch and any Mods of this Guild.

i only meant to go on about example of just how dangerous the Occult can be. i got carried away.

and HA! xd me, the next Crowley! while in some ways the thought is very appealing, i don't think i'd even WANT to be spreading insight into the Occult, let alone have ANY chance of being led to it by Fate itself. i'm too ******** up to be of any widespread credibility. any wisdom i may have will pass only to certain individuals, and in pieces, and it's all entirely questionable anyway. i absolutely REFUSE to accept that i even MAY be wise. although i have these irritating natural thoughts about what if i am. xd