T5:DR tier list...Discuss

[Ayane Kriyo]

I just took a second look at the list, and there isn't a single Yoshi to be found.  

[Shin Oni]

Yoshi's not that high anyway...

good mixup, crap damage...  

[Kradvity]

Isn't Anna a top tier again? Is she stronger, is her range better? I've only played DR a couple of times.  

[Icege]

I wouldn't say she's top tier. She's got good launchers, good mix-ups (FC,d/f+2 and FC,f+2), decent poke game, etc. She's not overbearing though.  

[Kradvity]

Icege

I wouldn't say she's top tier. She's got good launchers, good mix-ups (FC,d/f+2 and FC,f+2), decent poke game, etc. She's not overbearing though.

Okay, not top, but higher than before. Which is good enough.  

[BlueHeartShinigami]

Miyavi San

Actually...A.King should be B, So is Dragonuv, and Jin should be A. I kno Jin's move and how others play. Too bad Jin users (other then me) doesnt kno how to use him very properly or at the right time. And hes hard to use due to the lack of low attacks and such.

Really? Just how do you play with Jin?

Honestly, I'd have given Jin a higher ranking (B+). But that's just me. Jin doesn't have alot of good low attacks, but who needs low attacks when it's easy for him to switch on his attacks? He has excellent defense and offense, he strikes fast. If only he'd kept the Mishima fighting style... crying That's the only reason Devil Jin ranked higher. In my opinion, Jin is better. My Jin has yet to lose to a Devil Jin player. But hey, tiers aren't made by opinion but by popularity and effectiveness. If it were up to me, the highest tier would be Steve, Bruce, Jin, King and Law.  

[Miyavi San]

Indigo_Blue

Miyavi San

Actually...A.King should be B, So is Dragonuv, and Jin should be A. I kno Jin's move and how others play. Too bad Jin users (other then me) doesnt kno how to use him very properly or at the right time. And hes hard to use due to the lack of low attacks and such.

Really? Just how do you play with Jin?

Honestly, I'd have given Jin a higher ranking (B+). But that's just me. Jin doesn't have alot of good low attacks, but who needs low attacks when it's easy for him to switch on his attacks? He has excellent defense and offense, he strikes fast. If only he'd kept the Mishima fighting style... crying That's the only reason Devil Jin ranked higher. In my opinion, Jin is better. My Jin has yet to lose to a Devil Jin player. But hey, tiers aren't made by opinion but by popularity and effectiveness. If it were up to me, the highest tier would be Steve, Bruce, Jin, King and Law.

check out the Tekken Match Vids thread I made. Look at any RoyalFlush matches and thats how I usually play.  

[Shin Oni]

Indigo_Blue

Miyavi San

Actually...A.King should be B, So is Dragonuv, and Jin should be A. I kno Jin's move and how others play. Too bad Jin users (other then me) doesnt kno how to use him very properly or at the right time. And hes hard to use due to the lack of low attacks and such.

Really? Just how do you play with Jin?

Honestly, I'd have given Jin a higher ranking (B+). But that's just me. Jin doesn't have alot of good low attacks, but who needs low attacks when it's easy for him to switch on his attacks? He has excellent defense and offense, he strikes fast. If only he'd kept the Mishima fighting style... crying That's the only reason Devil Jin ranked higher. In my opinion, Jin is better. My Jin has yet to lose to a Devil Jin player. But hey, tiers aren't made by opinion but by popularity and effectiveness. If it were up to me, the highest tier would be Steve, Bruce, Jin, King and Law.

I dunno about A.King being B status...but he holds his own in his tier.

Jin....uh..compared to T4 Jin, yea he obviously won't be high. but Jin lacks old school LS. ehh...I don't really touch T5 Jin (especially DR.) but he does have his own traditional ground move like his father and granddad (looks like it's d+2 on grounded opponents.)

Jin's lows are fine. you still have d+4. uh...d+3+4 is ok. still not that great though seeing if blocked, you can easily launch him due to that slow recovery (i've always haded his d+3+4 anyway..) u/f+4 is alittle better.  

[BlueHeartShinigami]

Shin Oni

Indigo_Blue

Miyavi San

Actually...A.King should be B, So is Dragonuv, and Jin should be A. I kno Jin's move and how others play. Too bad Jin users (other then me) doesnt kno how to use him very properly or at the right time. And hes hard to use due to the lack of low attacks and such.

Really? Just how do you play with Jin?

Honestly, I'd have given Jin a higher ranking (B+). But that's just me. Jin doesn't have alot of good low attacks, but who needs low attacks when it's easy for him to switch on his attacks? He has excellent defense and offense, he strikes fast. If only he'd kept the Mishima fighting style... crying That's the only reason Devil Jin ranked higher. In my opinion, Jin is better. My Jin has yet to lose to a Devil Jin player. But hey, tiers aren't made by opinion but by popularity and effectiveness. If it were up to me, the highest tier would be Steve, Bruce, Jin, King and Law.

I dunno about A.King being B status...but he holds his own in his tier.

Jin....uh..compared to T4 Jin, yea he obviously won't be high. but Jin lacks old school LS. ehh...I don't really touch T5 Jin (especially DR.) but he does have his own traditional ground move like his father and granddad (looks like it's d+2 on grounded opponents.)

Jin's lows are fine. you still have d+4. uh...d+3+4 is ok. still not that great though seeing if blocked, you can easily launch him due to that slow recovery (i've always haded his d+3+4 anyway..) u/f+4 is alittle better.

Jin d+3+4 is something you have to work in, because experienced players can see right through it. I usually use the simple combo 1,2,3, d+3+4 ( which works on most intermediate players.). But the problem I see with most Jin players is that they depend on that kick too much and get punished more than they should.  

[Icege]

Shin Oni

Indigo_Blue

Miyavi San

Actually...A.King should be B, So is Dragonuv, and Jin should be A. I kno Jin's move and how others play. Too bad Jin users (other then me) doesnt kno how to use him very properly or at the right time. And hes hard to use due to the lack of low attacks and such.

Really? Just how do you play with Jin?

Honestly, I'd have given Jin a higher ranking (B+). But that's just me. Jin doesn't have alot of good low attacks, but who needs low attacks when it's easy for him to switch on his attacks? He has excellent defense and offense, he strikes fast. If only he'd kept the Mishima fighting style... crying That's the only reason Devil Jin ranked higher. In my opinion, Jin is better. My Jin has yet to lose to a Devil Jin player. But hey, tiers aren't made by opinion but by popularity and effectiveness. If it were up to me, the highest tier would be Steve, Bruce, Jin, King and Law.

I dunno about A.King being B status...but he holds his own in his tier.

Jin....uh..compared to T4 Jin, yea he obviously won't be high. but Jin lacks old school LS. ehh...I don't really touch T5 Jin (especially DR.) but he does have his own traditional ground move like his father and granddad (looks like it's d+2 on grounded opponents.)

Jin's lows are fine. you still have d+4. uh...d+3+4 is ok. still not that great though seeing if blocked, you can easily launch him due to that slow recovery (i've always haded his d+3+4 anyway..) u/f+4 is alittle better.

d+3+4 is attrocious unless you're using it after a low parry, punch parry, or CH d/f+3. It's RIDICULOUSLY punishable and the follow-ups just aren't that good.

If you've got people who don't understand the concept of blocking and not having to attack after everything, I'd use u/f+4 or iWS+2 over d+3+4 any day of the week. u/f+4 is (or is close to) the same speed and gives you much better damage. Same with iWS+2.

Jin is lacking in the low department. All he really has is d+4 and Hellsweep. d+4 means you don't get generic d+4 which is in it's own right a nice move. His hellsweep gets destroyed as well on block and is much easier to see than other Mishima hellsweeps.

He's solid mid. He's got great tracking and awesome pokes. He has nothing that really stands out above and beyond though.

Armour King would be at MOST mid. He was originally thought of as bottom tier, but he's got some things. He's unorthodox but is lacking some solid launchers. He's got some goofyness though.

Devil Jin is ranked higher because he's got d/f+4,4, EWGF (launch), more damager for juggles and on the wall, better lows, better throws, tracks just as well, better punishers, etc. You won't lose to a Devil Jin while playing against Jin because US Mishimas are trash. Very few US players can play Mishimas well (Bane, bacon's extra, KaNe, JinKid, AlexMan, Mad Ocx, etc). Playing against a good Devil Jin is horrible because you cannot sidestep without risking 45%. On top of that, he lacked good crushes in 5.0. Now he's got d/b+2 (not great, but decent) and u/f+4 (GREAT move).  

[BlueHeartShinigami]

Quote:

Devil Jin is ranked higher because he's got d/f+4,4, EWGF (launch), more damager for juggles and on the wall, better lows, better throws, tracks just as well, better punishers, etc. You won't lose to a Devil Jin while playing against Jin because US Mishimas are trash. Very few US players can play Mishimas well (Bane, bacon's extra, KaNe, JinKid, AlexMan, Mad Ocx, etc). Playing against a good Devil Jin is horrible because you cannot sidestep without risking 45%. On top of that, he lacked good crushes in 5.0. Now he's got d/b+2 (not great, but decent) and u/f+4 (GREAT move).

Oh, really? Then I have to play the non US Mishima players. Are they really that better? And in the meantime, where are these good US Mishima players?  

[Icege]

Indigo_Blue

Quote:

Devil Jin is ranked higher because he's got d/f+4,4, EWGF (launch), more damager for juggles and on the wall, better lows, better throws, tracks just as well, better punishers, etc. You won't lose to a Devil Jin while playing against Jin because US Mishimas are trash. Very few US players can play Mishimas well (Bane, bacon's extra, KaNe, JinKid, AlexMan, Mad Ocx, etc). Playing against a good Devil Jin is horrible because you cannot sidestep without risking 45%. On top of that, he lacked good crushes in 5.0. Now he's got d/b+2 (not great, but decent) and u/f+4 (GREAT move).

Oh, really? Then I have to play the non US Mishima players. Are they really that better? And in the meantime, where are these good US Mishima players?

JinKid - OK/TX
AlexMan - CA
KaNe - CA
Mad Ocx - NYC
Bane - ATL
bacon's extra - SC

Yes. Mishimas are Godlike when you've got solid execution and experience. You CANNOT whiff a move, or do a move that is -13 on block because you WILL be EWGF which will lead to 40%, potentially 60% if you guess wrong afterwards (or they'll flat out do 45%). Then you've got to deal with wavedash mix-ups that are a complete guessing game. If you try to poke them out, you'll get hit with EWGF or they'll backdash cancel and EWGF the whiff. If you try to go high or duck, they'll go into iWS+2 which will launch you and it'll end just like it would have if they had EWGF. They've got access to all their throws, and they've got a Hellsweep which will not end well for you.

US players just don't play as often as Koreans and the Japanese due to the size of the country as well as our culture. As a result, it's very hard to find good Mishima players because they require constant practice and playtime.  

[BlueHeartShinigami]

Well, do you fear them, Icege? It sounds like suicide but I think I just found a new goal. If there's a whole different level of Mishimas out there then I have to face one!  

[Miyavi San]

Icege

Indigo_Blue

Quote:

Devil Jin is ranked higher because he's got d/f+4,4, EWGF (launch), more damager for juggles and on the wall, better lows, better throws, tracks just as well, better punishers, etc. You won't lose to a Devil Jin while playing against Jin because US Mishimas are trash. Very few US players can play Mishimas well (Bane, bacon's extra, KaNe, JinKid, AlexMan, Mad Ocx, etc). Playing against a good Devil Jin is horrible because you cannot sidestep without risking 45%. On top of that, he lacked good crushes in 5.0. Now he's got d/b+2 (not great, but decent) and u/f+4 (GREAT move).

Oh, really? Then I have to play the non US Mishima players. Are they really that better? And in the meantime, where are these good US Mishima players?

JinKid - OK/TX
AlexMan - CA
KaNe - CA
Mad Ocx - NYC
Bane - ATL
bacon's extra - SC

Yes. Mishimas are Godlike when you've got solid execution and experience. You CANNOT whiff a move, or do a move that is -13 on block because you WILL be EWGF which will lead to 40%, potentially 60% if you guess wrong afterwards (or they'll flat out do 45%). Then you've got to deal with wavedash mix-ups that are a complete guessing game. If you try to poke them out, you'll get hit with EWGF or they'll backdash cancel and EWGF the whiff. If you try to go high or duck, they'll go into iWS+2 which will launch you and it'll end just like it would have if they had EWGF. They've got access to all their throws, and they've got a Hellsweep which will not end well for you.

US players just don't play as often as Koreans and the Japanese due to the size of the country as well as our culture. As a result, it's very hard to find good Mishima players because they require constant practice and playtime.

lol KaNe is in the list, the DJ player.
and whats whiff again?...
anyway, yeah its hard to find good mishima players. Often in the US or Canada (I manage to find time) theres schoolwork and jobs we have to go which takes alot of our time. so less time to practise.


Other notes:
Your right, Jin lacks low attacks. d+4 is ok and so is hellsweep (unless i thinking the wrong thing) which makes Jin players rely on sidestepping/frames/etc.

d+3+4, I only use em if I ever feel the need. Unless it has the same properties as Asuka (first strike is a low then mid, but for Jin its all mid) it might be worth a bit.

Theres also some ways to launch other then iWS+2, and u/f4. Theres d/f+2, cds,d/f+1 (its basically f,n,d/f+1), and unless its been blocked, f,f+3,1 (then either 1,2~2,2,3 or other ones I forgotten)  

[Icege]

IB: Fear? Never and nobody. Respect? Highly.

Miyavi: d+3+4 hits mid first. It's Jin's low parry punisher. Whiffing is when you attack and it hits nothing but air. d/f+2 needs to be CH to launch, and chances of hitting that are slim. CDS+1 (electric version) is great for wake up since it's only jab punishable, which makes it a viable option as opposed to iWS+2. The axe kick launcher isn't a real launcher and kinda sucks. Let me take that back. It's not bad, but there are better options.