The Silmarillion: A Group Reading [update 4.12.05]

[Zurgi]

Uh huh Falathrim, blame it on the powers, oh that solves everything xd  

[Caeleste]

I'm late for the Ainulindale, so in short: I think it gets better as you come to the end of the chapter. It's really kinda slow in the first few pages, so I think that's why no one ever gets far in the Silmarillion.

As for the Valaquenta, I enjoyed it. I don't really like the Valar, but not because they're are assholes/jerks/morons. I mean, the world is full of jerks. It's because they seem kind of - one dimensional. It's hard to explain, but out of all of them, Melkor seems to be one of the few who isn't. I swear I saw a line where it said at some point he was torn between light and dark (but not in those words. Something more subtle.) And that just seems to me that he actually has more than one facet to him. The rest of the Valar are just kinda like "We smite you in anger! Grrr. Shiny happy singing birds, big angry waves! Pretty flowers corny 'when we're together everything is super duper and we're so much more powerful together than apart!'"
It seems like they're just there to be the deus ex machina.

It just looks to me like the people who are tempted by the dark side seem easier to connect with or imagine as being real, because for us, it's impossible not to be tempted by the dark side.  

[Lithwen]

Akiyo

The rest of the Valar are just kinda like "We smite you in anger! Grrr. Shiny happy singing birds, big angry waves! Pretty flowers corny 'when we're together everything is super duper and we're so much more powerful together than apart!'"

xd Kiyo, this is why I'm going to force you to marry me someday.

Anyways, I guess it's time for me to become a "bandwagon jumper-on-er".

I've always liked the Valaquenta personally. Not a hell of whole lot happens, but I do enjoy the descriptions of the Valar, though they always bring back memories of my Greek phase, when I would read bios of the Greek Gods constantly. In fact, I find myself drawing a lot of connections between the Valar and the Gods of Olympus, even when I try to force myself not to. Nessa and Artemis, for example, seem excactly alike.

Fave Vala is, and will probably always be, Tulkas, though this is from a personal veiwpoint. As a writer, or as an amateur judge of literature, Melkor definitley comes across as a much more complex and interesting character than the others.

I've also managed to stay immune thus far to the hatemongering of our beloved Falathrim. Ok, so the Valar weren't perfect. They messed up now and then, they sometimes didn't seem to have a clue what they were doing, but come on- where would Arda be without them?

If I wasn't so hungry, I'm sure I could find more to comment on, but I am, so I can't. On the bright side, I can finally get the Sil out of my locker tomorrow. ^.^

Since I missed the Ainulindale, I shall sneak in some very breif comments here. The first time I read it, I almost put the book down after the first few paragraphs. But when I read it again recently, I realized that it does have it's good points. The battle of music, for instance, provides the fuel for hours of inspired writing or philosophizing (Is that a word? Do I care?), at least for me. And Tolkien did a great job of immediatley immersing the reader in a situation where the line between "The fake history of a fictional place" and "True myth" becomes blurred. If that makes any sense, which I don't think it does.  

[Hironaur]

Well I read the Valaquenta last night, and really don't have much to say about it. Even though it is rather boring, I think it was crucial to have a description of all the Valar. And even though I still love Aulë, I think I like Ulmo a great deal to. (And this is just going by their bios here) I really don't have much to say about this chapter, but if I think of anything else I'll post it.  

[Elainya]

I got a bit carried away. I was reading on the way to school because I'd decided to take the bus to save gas. Anyway, it's an hour and a half trip. I, well, um, there and back (Again) from school, I got to Return of the Noldor...now I have a whole bunch of questions about the chapters that we won't get to for like, weeks. >,<

Okay, I do remember a question though. Is the music of the Ainur actually a song, or is it described as music simply as a metaphore for creation?  

[Thaxul]

The Valaquenta...nothing much to say here. It was a neccessary chapter, as Hironaur said. I don't have a favourite Vala as of yet, and i don't think the Valar are jerks/asses because I have no reason to. Maybe further on in the book, i will agree with Falathrim on this, or maybe not. We will have to see.  

[curumo]

The only thing of notability in the Valaquenta was the fact that Varda rejected Melkor before the Music and I also can't get over the fact that Melkor is the most powerful.

And I love him. And hate Tulkas.  

[Imyavie]

Yay I got my copy! I can join the Sil group?

Since I bought my Sil copy last week, I have read Ainulindale and Valaquenta. I really liked it. For some reason, bios of characters and inforamtion about each Valar was so interesting. I don't really have a favourite as of yet...
*Since I'm kinda new at reading this book, please don't laugh at me if I have some questions about certain events, kay?*  

[Nimbrethil]

imyavie

*Since I'm kinda new at reading this book, please don't laugh at me if I have some questions about certain events, kay?*

Course you can join. And no one will laugh; asking/answering questions is one of the benefits of the reading.  

[Elainya]

When I read The Silmarillion the first time around (Okay fine, I'll admit, I didn't finish it then, and I only skimmed it, really) I was 14. My favorite Vala was Yavanna. Now, re-reading it again, my favorite is Ulmo, because he seems to be the last to really forsake Middle Earth, and he was the one most willing to help everyone. I also really like Tulkas for kicking the crap out of Melkor.

EDIT:
I just thought of something more to add on. Is it just me, or is Melkor a pansy? Every time he is described, it seems, it says somewhere that he was afraid. He was afraid of Tulkas, afraid of the light of the trees, in fact he's afraid so much I'm lead to believe that he's a big bully.  

[Falathrim]

Melkor is the only Vala with the ability to feel fear.

I still haven't read the Valaquenta. Hmmm.

*starts reading*  

[Elainya]

Falathrim

Melkor is the only Vala with the ability to feel fear.

He is? Where does it say that? I remember it saying that he has a wider range of emotions that the others, but I didn't remember it specifically saying that he's the only one that can fear. I know that they can all mourn, which is something they do pretty regularily. I was thinking, actually, that to mourn is, in part, to fear. Why do people cry over death? Because they fear it. *Shrug* just a thought.  

[Falathrim]

Valaquenta

Falathrim's Favorite Quote

HERE ENDS THE VALAQUENTA

Falathrim's Real Favorite Quote

From splendour he fell through arrogance and contempt for all things save himself, a spirit wasteful and pitiless. Understanding he turned to subtlety in perverting to his own will all that he would use, until he became a liar without shame. He began with the desire of Light, but when he could not posess it for himself alone, he descended through fire and wrath into a great burning, down into Darkness. And darkness he used most in his evil works upon Arda, and filled it with fear for all living things.

~~~

Valaquenta. Woo. Interesting information the first time around. Slightly intriguing the second time around. Getting to be a bit much the third time around. But fourth time around? SWEET MERCIFUL ERU MAKE IT STOP!

To be honest, I don't have any witty remarks. True, the Valar are jerks, and yes, I was going to consider hatemongering for this post. But I realized that the Valaquenta doesn't really touch on the wrath of the Valar in enough detail. Sure, it mentions it in Ulmo's mini-bio, but it's simply not enough for me to throw up my debate.

That's best saved for the Flight of the Noldor. So, you have something to look forward too. wink

As you know, my favorite Vala is Varda. She may be just as jerky as the rest, but being the Star-kindler makes me love her anyway. In her lives the Light of Iluvatar. So pretty. crying Second favorite is Ulmo. If any Vala werne't a jerk, it's him.

Hmmm. I wonder if I could have fit the word jerk in her a few more times...  

[Glorfirith Annun]

I read the Valaquenta.

Falathrim made me!

Which is good or I wouldn't have read it for like the tenth time. Don't get me wrong, I like it and all but I just wasn't in the mood to read it again. I even found that I was able to say the next lines without even reading them... next step would be to have it completely memorized. Hopefully that won't happen lol.

My only comments other than "thank Eru, that's over!" is that it's really useful for getting to know which Vala is which and stuff. The question is, am I going to remember Eonwe or... oops, already forgotten. Give me minute!

*thinks*

I give up. Varda's handmaiden! I can never remember. Boo. It only comes up in every other crossword too lol. Dang nabit...  

[Lithwen]

Glorfirith Annun

The question is, am I going to remember Eonwe or... oops, already forgotten. Give me minute!

*thinks*

I give up. Varda's handmaiden! I can never remember. Boo. It only comes up in every other crossword too lol. Dang nabit...

Erm... Ilmare maybe? (accents go in there somewhere...)
Gah,I'm going to check that later, but I THINK it's right.

Anyways, I guess I should start reading the Quenta Silmarillion, but I'm preoccupied with Hamlet at the moment, so I'll probably post my comments on the next part on the very last day possible. sweatdrop