::Grill 13 Restaurant:: NEW Pictures on the Menu!

[Biohazard EXTREME]

-----------ALL THE NEW POSTS ARE ABOVE THIS ONE!------------

Director's Cut was only for PS1.
You're thinking of just the Remake, I think.  

[Elaineybrainey]

oh yeah. I had to go check. xp  

[Biohazard EXTREME]

I gotta admit, though, I found the GameCube's controller to be one of the most confortable I've ever held.  

[Elaineybrainey]

i hate hate hate how big the gamecube controller is  

[Biohazard EXTREME]

Isn't it smaller than the Xbox 360 controller?  

[Vankala]

I think the 360 and GC controlelrs are about the same size. But, i agree on the GC being really comfortable. Can't explain why though.  

[Canas Renvall]

Well, just got back from Vegas a few hours ago. With the time jump forward, we got to our airport at 5:15AM. x_X I slept the four hours on the plane, though, so I'm not too tired.

Chase Me To The End

Anyone else have a Black Friday story?

Do I ever. Let me start by saying sorry to Harold. xd

So, last year we see that they have terabyte external hard drives at Staples for about a hundred bucks. Awesome deal, so we go there (my parents, brother and I) to pick one up. Unfortunately, they're sold out. So my mom and I are waiting near this doorbuster sale table selling stuff like USB keyboards while my dad is in line to buy other things we had come for. I turn around to look at the table and I see one of the hard drives just sitting there, like magic.

I point it out to my mom, and she ushers me quickly to take it to my dad. I thought it was a little odd, but I chalked it up to her not wanting to miss out on it. In line, just after we check out, my mom pesters my dad like "Bob, we need to go. Now."

Here I was, wondering what the hell she was talking about until I heard it.

"WHERE THE HELL IS MY DAMN TERABYTE?!" I went doe-eyed at my mom who kept telling me to hurry up.

As we kept walking towards the exit, I heard his wife yelling at him.

"GODDAMNIT HAROLD, I TOLD YOU NOT TO PUT IT DOWN! NOT FOR ONE SECOND!!"

So, in essence, I inadvertently stole someone's terabyte HDD. Thankfully he hadn't paid for it yet. My mom had known when I pointed it out what had happened, so that's why she wanted me to be fast; she wanted to get it in the bag and get out before Harold came back.

God, I hope he's okay after a whole year. She sounded ready to divorce him. >_>;

Chase Me To The End

@Canas: Have you've been gambling in the arcades? Lol.

I wish. They're so adamant about nobody under 21 (surprisingly razz ) being on the gaming floor. Hell, even in the airport where they had penny slot machines before you board the plane, my family was just putting a few bucks in for the fun of it and I had to stand at least 10 feet away since it's illegal for someone under 21 to "play or loiter near a slot machine". ******** stupid, but hey, it's the law.

AngelaAshford

@Canas: I heard about that version of HotD4! It sounds so awesome!

We were so close to beating it! Since there's a line for it, you don't get any continues. You have to get in line and start over from the beginning. Still a ton of fun though, definitely check it out if you ever find it somewhere.

As for controllers, GC is actually my second favorite behind the 360. In fact, at E3 2004? 5? Sometime just before the start of this gen for games, they did a poll for all controllers since the creation of games and the GC beat out everything for the comfortability. DualShock 2 killed in terms of rumble feature though.

Snugly, btw, Bio.

EDIT: Uh... same problem that Bio had. My post just jumped to the top of the page. o_o;  

[King of Paradise]

Biohazard EXTREME

I think it's the concave curves. They just hug your fingers so... Snuggly? Snugglily?

Snuggiliciously. Yes, the Gamecube controller is my favorite.

@Canas: If she didn't divorce him, I'm pretty sure you majorly c**k blocked him.

EDIT: Duh f***? Lol, same problem everyone else had.  

[Biohazard EXTREME]

I think it's the concave curves. They just hug your fingers so... Snuggly? Snugglily?

EDIT:
So, I just read this little article on IGN: http://ps3.ign.com/articles/105/1050038p1.html

And it proves a good point. Not even so much that we don't want a new generation, but that we don't need it.
The fact is, here's the difference between the last generation and this generation.
Everything that we were capable of in the PS2 era, we were capable of in the PS1 era. We were just limited by the hardware.
Yes, it would take longer to create the assets on the PS2 than on PS1, but it still required no more difficulty.
I could probably model half, if not all of the cast of FF7 in one day.
And maybe it would take me two to four days to model a decent looking PS2 character.
But that's peanuts. That's nothing.
The pre-rendered levels in Final Fantasy on PS1 probably took longer to make than real-time levels on the PS2. And still, it wouldn't have been significant. Because the bulk of the development time would be taken up on animations and programming.
The only difference between PS1 and PS2 are the limitations.
With PS3, it's completely different.
It's the LACK of limitations that makes things more difficult. Sure, PS2 sported some sort of gloss and specular on its 3D models, and it looked nice. It's not that hard to make.
But with the PS3, you have to make normal maps, and to make a good looking normal map is a job from hell. Going into Zbrush and making the intricate details like the wrinkles on the face, the folds in the clothing. Etc. etc. It's long, and depending on your level of patience, potentially extremely tedious.
The fact is, it is what it is. And the PlayStation 3 is three years old now, and only NOW, do we hear developers saying, "Yeah, we're finally gonna be able to put 100% of the PS3's full potential in our game." And even that's Square-Enix, Naughty Dog, in other words, the best of the best.
But if we were to make a NEW generation, with even more processing power, and more graphics. Yes, we might end up with games rivaling to Pixar movies... But do you have any idea how expensive those games would be? Here's the fact... It's either gonna take a long, long time to make. And since the developers are on salary, the publishers will need to charge more to make profit. OR, they're gonna take not very long, in the studios which have 300+ staff. But again, they're all getting paid, so the publisher has to spend a crapload of time as it is.

I mean, I went to game developer school... And trust me, when I look at the PS3 graphics. It scares me. It's ******** intimidating! I look at... Drake, I look at the levels, and I go crazy. I just think about what it would take to create something like that... The time, and the patience.
And, even if I HAD the time, my computer wouldn't be able to handle it.
And going one step beyond... Jesus... I don't even wanna think about what that would be like.

In any case, bottom line is. What do we really need?

Back in the days of NES, we said, "We want to see a bit moe details on the characters."
In the SNES days, we said, "We'd like to see the character more up close."
In the PS1 days, we said, "We'd like to see those 3D graphics smoother."
In the PS2 days... Honestly, even in the PS2 days, looking at games like God of War, Silent Hill 2, Halo, Doom 3 and Remake, I already went, "Man... Some of this stuff is pretty much perfect."
And now, we are where we are... And frankly, I don't think we need to go any further.
I'm sure we will, because electronic companies are greedy ********... But even Sony said that the PS3 will be here at least ten years. Let's just keep it as it is.
Right now, Microsoft needs to focus on making the 360 stable, so that it doesn't break down.
The PS3... Umm... Needs to focus on... Keep being awesome? I honestly think the PS3 is relatively flawless. Its only drawback is that developers are intimidated by the cell processor, but that's only a matter of time. Look at BioWare, they just finished Dragon Age, and are now saying that they'll be developing a lot more PS3 games in the future.

And that's my 2 cents on the topic.  

[Canas Renvall]

Biohazard EXTREME

I think it's the concave curves. They just hug your fingers so... Snuggly? Snugglily?

EDIT:
So, I just read this little article on IGN: http://ps3.ign.com/articles/105/1050038p1.html

And it proves a good point. Not even so much that we don't want a new generation, but that we don't need it.
The fact is, here's the difference between the last generation and this generation.
Everything that we were capable of in the PS2 era, we were capable of in the PS1 era. We were just limited by the hardware.
Yes, it would take longer to create the assets on the PS2 than on PS1, but it still required no more difficulty.
I could probably model half, if not all of the cast of FF7 in one day.
And maybe it would take me two to four days to model a decent looking PS2 character.
But that's peanuts. That's nothing.
The pre-rendered levels in Final Fantasy on PS1 probably took longer to make than real-time levels on the PS2. And still, it wouldn't have been significant. Because the bulk of the development time would be taken up on animations and programming.
The only difference between PS1 and PS2 are the limitations.
With PS3, it's completely different.
It's the LACK of limitations that makes things more difficult. Sure, PS2 sported some sort of gloss and specular on its 3D models, and it looked nice. It's not that hard to make.
But with the PS3, you have to make normal maps, and to make a good looking normal map is a job from hell. Going into Zbrush and making the intricate details like the wrinkles on the face, the folds in the clothing. Etc. etc. It's long, and depending on your level of patience, potentially extremely tedious.
The fact is, it is what it is. And the PlayStation 3 is three years old now, and only NOW, do we hear developers saying, "Yeah, we're finally gonna be able to put 100% of the PS3's full potential in our game." And even that's Square-Enix, Naughty Dog, in other words, the best of the best.
But if we were to make a NEW generation, with even more processing power, and more graphics. Yes, we might end up with games rivaling to Pixar movies... But do you have any idea how expensive those games would be? Here's the fact... It's either gonna take a long, long time to make. And since the developers are on salary, the publishers will need to charge more to make profit. OR, they're gonna take not very long, in the studios which have 300+ staff. But again, they're all getting paid, so the publisher has to spend a crapload of time as it is.

I mean, I went to game developer school... And trust me, when I look at the PS3 graphics. It scares me. It's ******** intimidating! I look at... Drake, I look at the levels, and I go crazy. I just think about what it would take to create something like that... The time, and the patience.
And, even if I HAD the time, my computer wouldn't be able to handle it.
And going one step beyond... Jesus... I don't even wanna think about what that would be like.

In any case, bottom line is. What do we really need?

Back in the days of NES, we said, "We want to see a bit moe details on the characters."
In the SNES days, we said, "We'd like to see the character more up close."
In the PS1 days, we said, "We'd like to see those 3D graphics smoother."
In the PS2 days... Honestly, even in the PS2 days, looking at games like God of War, Silent Hill 2, Halo, Doom 3 and Remake, I already went, "Man... Some of this stuff is pretty much perfect."
And now, we are where we are... And frankly, I don't think we need to go any further.
I'm sure we will, because electronic companies are greedy ********... But even Sony said that the PS3 will be here at least ten years. Let's just keep it as it is.
Right now, Microsoft needs to focus on making the 360 stable, so that it doesn't break down.
The PS3... Umm... Needs to focus on... Keep being awesome? I honestly think the PS3 is relatively flawless. Its only drawback is that developers are intimidated by the cell processor, but that's only a matter of time. Look at BioWare, they just finished Dragon Age, and are now saying that they'll be developing a lot more PS3 games in the future.

And that's my 2 cents on the topic.

I agree, the gaming industry has mastered 2D, apparently mastered 3D... so what's next? VR, just like rumors said the Revolution (working name for the Wii at the time) would be? A home console that can transport you into a vibrant, real world? Natal/WiiMotion Plus/Sony Wand seem to be a start down this path... but like you said, how much would it cost? How long would it take? How many people would you need minimum for something that large-scale?

And I really don't want to get into this, but the 360 has become more stable. With the older models out and done now, and the new and improved 60GB Pros and the 120GB Elites out, RRoD is a thing of the past (or, to be fair, is much less prominent now). Microsoft did a good job in stepping up to the plate and taking responsibility for their product. Sure, it was their fault for being greedy and using cheap s**t so they could get on the market a year before its competitors in the first place, but it owned up to its mistake to the tune of well over $1 billion for its fans.

I just say the console wars are stupid in general. Each system has its ups and downs (yes Bio, even the PS3), but overall each one is pretty damn good (yes Bio, even the Wii). And each one has its fair share of good exclusives. And to be fair, I'll list four for each system. 'Cause I love my babies equally. biggrin

PS3: Uncharted series, God of War series, Ratchet and Clank series, MGS4
360: Gears of War series, Left 4 Dead series, Lost Odyssey, Mass Effect series
Wii: Super Mario Galaxy, Metroid Prime Trilogy (MP1-3! Woo!), No More Heroes, New Super Mario Bros. Wii. And if you say MP Trilogy is two rehashes, then just say MP3: Corruption instead. razz

I say ******** the wars, I'm happy with my PSWii60. biggrin

That's my two cents.  

[MadamTarantula]

Biohazard EXTREME

Back in the days of NES, we said, "We want to see a bit moe details on the characters."

We wanted our pixels to look like anime jailbait? xd

The 360 controller is slightly larger. 3nodding

The GC controller is comfortable, but I hate its d-pad.

Edit: Why the ******** is my post here? WTF is going on?  

[Biohazard EXTREME]

Well, it took me this long to realize that Gaia is bumping the posts to the top, instead of simply eating them.

Anywho, Canas, while the Red Ring of Death is less prominent now, there's still plenty of things that go wrong with the 360. And honestly, I'm pretty sure the failure rate went down, but not that much. Last time I checked it went down from 30% to like, 20%. I mean, it's progress, but there's still no way in hell I'm gonna buy a 360. I bought a laptop not long ago, and it broke down on me on the second day. And that was Toshiba.
So I sure as hell am not gonna take that risk with Microsoft.

As for the virtual reality... I mean, the PS3 was not built for motion controls. Yet, they found a way to implement them and are doing a damn good job at it, from those hardware showcases.
They're already promising that with the appropriate TVs, it'll be able to provide real 3D games.

If it does come to Virtual reality, do you not think they'll be able to make some kind of an accessory that you could simply plug into the PS3, and have the PS3 do the work?
I mean, that's a very good point that the article brought up, is that when it comes to compatibility with various accessories, the current generation of consoles pretty much self-upgrades.

And lastly, yes, yes, we all know you have all three current gen consoles. Quit bragging, not all of us have that kind of money. In Wii's face though, No More Heroes is being released on the PS3 and 360, so I will be able to enjoy it!


Sidebar: I finally beat Post Mortem today. If you don't know what it is, it's an investigative adventure game that came out in 2002. If you played Still Life, it's the direct sequel to Post Mortem. I gotta say, something about those investigative thriller adventure games that I absolutely love. It's like an interactive mystery novel with kick a** puzzles. Love it. I just ordered Still Life 2 off Amazon, which came out earlier this year. Can't wait!


Sidebar Sidebar: Did anyone see the trailer for Universal Soldier 3? It looks awesome! Me and my friends are gonna have a Van Damme-a-thon when the movie comes out.  

[Biohazard EXTREME]

Thee Stranger

Secondly, I hate the console wars too. Not the war itself, but the fanboys surrounding it, and the never-ending d**k measuring contest of why-my-gaming-console-is-better-than-yours. It's just retardedness. Yes, I myself own all three, but even when I didn't, I never took part in all that crap. That said, I'll always be true to my champion: Nintendo.

You know, I'd take a console war d**k measuring over, "Look at my achievments" d**k measuring, any day. If I could have a trophy for denouncing all other trophies, I'd take it.

Thee Stranger

But Bio, I really don't see how you can rag on the 360 so hard for its failure rates. I mean, look at the first models of the PS1 and the PS2. They were both cheap pieces of s**t. Our original PS1 started shitting the bed after only a couple months. The games started skipping and we eventually had to tip the thing on its side in order for it play anything, before it completely died and we had to get a new one. The first model Playstation was infamous for its disk drive problems, because of design flaws and the fact that the CD drive's components were made with cheap plastic. PS2 had plenty of problems of its own. Mine never completely crapped-out on me, but it stopped playing DVD movies probably a little less than a year after I got it, and I would get "No Disc" errors just about every other time I popped in a game. Sony was actually sued over that, probably because they weren't compensating their customers. And I'm pretty sure they had to recall the first models of the slimline, because they were overheating, and in some cases, even combusting. Just about every PS2 owner I know has had one problem or another with it. One guy I knew back in school had to have his replaced, like, 3 times.

Well, when the first model of the PS1 came out, I was still in Russia, and I just got my NES, so I wasn't around for that time.
And honestly, I got my PS2 a year after it came out, and it served me perfectly until I traded it in, and got my PS3. The Xbox 360 has been out since 2005. By now, its failure rate should be less than 1%. Personal experience, Sony has never failed me.
And seeing my friend crack his 360 open, take out the disc drive, do some weird thing, where he uses a CD to separate it from the rest of the system to make sure they're a different temperature. I don't know what the hell it's all about. And only THEN is it gonna work. I'm not willing to go through something like that, just for a few games that the PS3 doesn't have, such as Gears of War, Mass Effect and a couple of decent JRPGs.

Thee Stranger

The PS3 is really an exception to this rule. It's the first Sony console I've ever owned that wasn't made with cheap, shoddy hardware. It's the only Sony console I've had that has run flawlessly. I do realize that the 360's failure rate is much worse, though. I'm on my third 360. I've never been on my 3rd of any game console ever. And everyone I know who owns a 360 (with the exception of Elliot Salem) has had to have it replaced at least once. That's pretty bad. BUT, Microsoft always fixes it for free, in a fairly timely manner, and it always comes back to you with a free month of XBOX Live, and sometimes they even give you points to download games on the arcade for the inconvenience. But yeah, it's still kind of a pain in the a**.

Well, as far as I know, Red Rign of Death is a free fix. But outside of the Warranty, any other problem it might have, you're on your own. Like my friend's problem. I don't even know exactly what it is.
Plus I worked at a game store, and remembering how many times people came back saying that their 360 scratched a big circle on their CDs... That's almost worse than the console breaking down, because places that do resurfacing don't even provide that service for those rings.

Thee Stranger

I prefer the PS3 myself. Simply because I have an older model of the 360 without the HDMI, and I'm really not too keen on having to shell out another $100 for a wireless adapter, plus a monthly subscription in order to play online when I can play most of the games that 360 has on the PS3 without those extra costs. And yeah, I'm not too huge into the online gaming. Like, I just get a game and try out the online mode real quick, and I get completely friggin' wrecked by a bunch of a annoying 13 year-olds from Britain or some s**t, because all they do is play the damn game all day. That's no fun. And since I have no desire to devote my life to it in order to get to their level, there's really no point unless I really, really enjoy the game. Like MGS4's online. And really, the single player campaign often really suffers on account of the attention to the online nowadays, which sucks. If I was huge into the whole online scene in the first place, I wouldn't be a console gamer; I'd be a PC gamer.

You know, I was worried that Uncharted 2 would suffer because of its multiplayer. But yeah, it's an exception to the rule. Look at Halo 3. Awesome multiplayer, man! Oh, and there's a 6 hour campaign somewhere in there, too... Whoo! Story? Who cares about the story? It's a game! Where's my Fallout 3 multiplayer? This game sucks!
And so on, and so forth.
I really respect the developers who don't implement a multiplayer into their games nowadays.
Although lately, the Multiplayer Deathamtch fad seems to have been replaced by the Online Co-op fad.
And Capcom was quick to cash in. But let's not get into that.

Thee Stranger

Lastly, the article has some good points here, is insightful there, but it was written by a Sony fanboy. I can't say as I like how it, like, disregards the Wii like it's not a viable next-gen system or something. Oh, and then we got the last paragraph. Butthurt that Nintendo is handing Microsoft and Sony's asses to them, because they're a smart company, and they've been in this s**t since '85 and survived. Up until the Wii, the console wars have been pretty much nothing but a graphical arms race. Look at that Dual Shock 3 you're holding. It's pretty much the same Dual Shock controller you were holding when you were playing the PS1 (which, by the way, borrowed both the analog and the rumble from the N64 controller). Now with tacked-on motion controls.
Nintendo changed the way that the games play, as opposed to continuing on with the mindless graphical arms race, and it paid off for them. Because the graphics don't change the gameplay, which plays pretty much exactly the same and just as good as it did on the older consoles. Now, I'm not saying the motion controls are always better, per se. But at least they're new and different. And often a lot of fun. So while the Wii may not be next-gen in terms of graphical capabilities, it is next-gen in terms of the gameplay (which hadn't really changed since the 5th generation). That's evident in the fact that Sony and Microsoft are now "playing catch up". And for an article that goes on and on about how graphics are largely irrelevant in today's landscape, it's all quite ironic that Wii doesn't qualify because it can't run in 1080p.

You know, I just love it. When the Wii was first coming out, all Sony and Microsoft fanboys did was rag on the Wii; its graphics and its motion controls and stuff. Everyone took it as a big joke. Now look at it. Now Microsoft is bringing the motion controls. Now Sony has its very own d***o controller. Life will go on, the sun will rise and set, and the Sony fanboys will keep on ragging on the Wii while enjoying Nintendo's innovations on their Playstation's. As always.

What I didn't like about the Wii Campaign, and the overall message that people started convincing themselves of, for some reason is that... It's like, "I choose gameplay over graphics." Okay, that's fair, but that's like implying that using a standard controller isn't fun anymore. Since when? It might not be Nintendo's fault, necessarily, but that's the excuse the Wii fanboys gave. "I'd rather the game be fun."
At what point did video games with standard controllers stop being fun?
I mean, you might disagree about the Wii aspect of the article... But seriously... If the Wii is Nintendo's final generation, would you be satisfied with that? Or would you someday want to see a Zelda game that looks like Sould Calibur 4. (only using that game because Link was in SC2 for the NGC) The article is saying that Sony and Microsoft don't NEED to make another generation of consoles.

And quite frankly, I think Nintendo does.

Honestly, as successful as the Wii might be, it's not exactly overflowing with A titles. It's the casual market and little kids that made it as successful as it is. That's the truth. I'm not saying it's a bad console. I'm just saying that it's third party support is s**t. Relatively, I mean. It's got a few good third party games, like No More Heroes. But most of them are shovelware, or just without real effort.
I had a Wii, and it came down to, "Are there enough games on it that I'll play for more than 2 days? No."
Now at the time, the case was the same with the PS3, but with the PS3, I had a completely different question. My question was, "Is the next Silent Hill out on it? Yes. Is the next Metal Gear on it? Yes. Is the nest Resident Evil out on it? Yes." Of course, then I dropped that Resident Evil like a $5 hooker. But the point remains, that if I didn't know my essentials were coming out on the PS3, I don't know if I would've bought it.
If there was no MGS or Silent Hill, I'd probably still be enjoying the hell out of my PS2, saying, "Maybe I'll get a PS3 this Christmas!"

Thee Stranger

((and no, Bio. That's not directed towards you. I know you're not big on the motion controls in general. I'm talking about the pure fanboys, who are pumped for their new "Wii-killing" d***o controller with glowing balls, which isn't much more advanced than the Wii Motion Plus, when d***o controllers were total fail just last week, before Sony had one. And trust me, they're out there. Just hit up a few forums. s**t, I met one at a party just last month. He was all explaining the controls to me as if it was some new, innovative thing, the likes of which had never been seen or something.))

Well, from what I've seen, Sony's motion controls are actually more functional than the Wii's, even with Motion Plus. But I'm not gonna get into that, because the simple truth is, I'm probably not gonna bother with them either way. Not unless like... One of my must haves pulls the d**k move of saying, "Next Metal Gear/Uncharted/Whatever will have mendatory motion controls."


In all truthful honesty. Speaking as a Sony fan. The only competition that actually intimidates me, is project natal.