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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 11:53 am
'Hahaha, when did I say I was going to let her go? That I was going to let any of you go. No, that doesn't sound fun. I want to play a game, what game do you think we should play,' Anzu laughed hysterically, firing another shot toward Shizuka.
((Yea, they'll probably kind of wait and see how he plays out in the Avengers segment of the franchise before considering that route again, though I know there have been talks and if they did do a Hulk movie at least at this stage it is Ruffalo they'd be planning to cast. Hulk is definitely a good team member but I can't really think of an arc that'd be universally interesting for him on his own.
Yea I always say I'm personally pro-life and politically pro-choice. Though I hope to never be in a situation where I'd have to test that personal stance. I also forgot in my last post to mention how amused I was by this mental image of cows turning into people. Definitely horror movie status stuff there. xd
Yea I'm pretty against the idea of artificially messing with genetics so I don't think it's actually something I'd want to see.))
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Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 3:09 pm
A horrified gasp emanated from Jounouchi's mouth. He twitched forward, but stopped himself. He took in a deep breath, "Please..." was all he could manage. What else could he say?
((He was a lot more liked in the Avengers than in Hulk. Not even just Bruce Banner but the Hulk himself. They animated his facial expressions better and gave him way more personality. But it is still hard to do a Hulk movie that isn't just 'let's capture him!' My personal favorite Hulk story is Planet Hulk, but that's a bit too... different for the movieverse I think. In it Iron Man, Dr. Strange, and some others deemed him too large of a threat, so sent him to an uninhabited planet. He struggled enough to send the ship off course though, landing on one that had a lot of different alien species, and was similar to a Roman gladiator planet, where they took slaves and made them fight. Hulk built a team and actually made friends and fell in love, but it wasn't stupid or forced; it was really well-written.
That is exactly how I feel, including hoping I never need to worry about that regarding my own body. Lawl at the cows.
Agreed.))
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Kitsune Ketz Kwineight Captain
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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 6:32 pm
Another shot rang out, and this time Seto noticed that none of the bullets, including the initial volley, had been fired from the same location. Were their multiple shooters, was this thing just that quick, was some sort of trap triggered (at least for the first wave). Another shot, from another direction. Their antagonist seemed content toying with Shizuka and traumatising Jounouchi for now. Seto needed to take this opportunity to plan, he wasn't entirely unprepared.
- - -
'Hmm...Please. I don't think I know that game, tell me how to play please,' more giggles, more gunfire. This wasn't quite contract fulfilling level suffering yet, but it certainly came close.
((Planet Hulk does sound pretty good but definitely not the kind of thing that works for mainstream film. But yes, they do need to do something other than origin/he can't control himself/let's capture him. I mean let's defeat/capture stories don't usually make the target the main protagonist, such as Godzilla. Hulk out of control seems the popular theme, but it seems to always lead into the movie paths that just don't work well.))
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Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 11:56 pm
Jounouchi cursed under his breath, looking over at his sister, deep lines of worry etched around his eyes. He gave her the most self-loathing, apologetic look, hating that he let her get involved in this. That this thing was after him, and was endangering Shizuka because of it. And Jounouchi couldn't do a damn thing about it. He was a failure as a brother, and the only thing he could do was be sorry. Pathetic.
((Thinking over it a bit, I think the best bet would be to actually make both Bruce and Hulk the protagonists. Two opposing, different characters with different goals, yet we have to empathize with both of them. Usually it's Bruce as the protagonist with Hulk as the 'misunderstood, chased monster' rather than a being we can fully relate to. But instead, they could do a movie where the two are starting to work out their situation, Bruce slowly trusting Hulk more and more to be a hero, Hulk reluctant to be relinquishing control back to Bruce. And then there could be a threat that needs Bruce's expertise as much as it does Hulk's strength, so they need to learn to balance their abilities in a way that can handle both sides of the threat.))
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Kitsune Ketz Kwineight Captain
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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:15 am
Another volley of shots. 'Don't just stand there quietly,' Anzu shrieked, 'I'm getting bored, I am not very nice when I'm bored.' This time the next potshot was directed toward Jounouchi, just to shake things up. For good measure to flung one past Seto's head as well.
'Talk to me,' she said, shifting her tone back to sweet and calm, 'Jounouchi what was your plan? How were you expecting this to go down? Let me into your head, pretty please?'
((Ugh, been fighting to get my chapter draft done. I'm not happy with it and it's not quite 'done' but it's 'done enough' for now and I am ignoring my thesis the rest of the time I'm in Cali. I have a conference poster to make but I have started it and that won't be as bad.
I guess I've never felt I've empathized with the Hulk part of him and I agree that's probably a problem. I'm not sure what the movie threat would be that would push the right balance, which is probably the bigger problem. Not just coming up with how to play them but what will be the catalyst/driving plot that make them work. I just can't imagine a Hulk movie ever working for me, but I wait to be pleasantly surprised. smile ))
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Posted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:43 pm
Jounouchi barely registered when the shot went past his own head, only worrying about Shizuka. Alright, he would talk to this damn demon. Anything to stall for time to... to do what? There was no way to pinpoint where the thing was, and even if he could, it'd be able to kill Shizuka before he made it over to stop it. Maybe it would run out of bullets soon? That could be something to stall for. It wasn't the best plan, but it was the only thing Jounouchi could come up with right now, and having that was better than nothing, "...I didn't know how this would go down..." he admitted, "But there was no way I was gonna put Shizuka at more risk by not showing up." his breath was shaky as he spoke. He licked his dry lips nervously, "Her safety is the most important thing to me."
((Sounds like an absolute blast. Good luck to you. XP
And I think that's exactly my point, that there hasn't really been a Hulk movie where we can fully empathize with him as a character. But if we put him on an equal level with Bruce plot-wise, that would help a lot. As far as an actual threat, I'm no writer, but if it was something like maybe the Leader (he is super intelligent from having gamma radiation to the head, and was seen being 'created' at the end of the last Hulk movie) using gamma radiation to make a team of differently-enhanced villains (one with strength like the Hulk, one that is just plain radioactive, one that can regenerate, etc.), then the Hulk would need to do the fighting, while Bruce would need to be working on a cure or a way to stop their enhancements, because that many would just be too many for even Hulk to handle. Obviously that's just a hamfisted plot I came up with on the spot, but just use it as an example for a driving point they could share.))
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Kitsune Ketz Kwineight Captain
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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 7:14 pm
Another shot, more manic laughter.
'Safety huh? Well see, we are learning already. So number one on Jounouchi's list is Shizuka's safety. And what is number one for the big shot CEO?'
Seto narrowed his eyes, still unable to pin down where the voice was coming from. 'My brother,' he answered curtly, though that clearly had to be known. Luckily Mokuba wasn't here, so for now that couldn't be used against him.
'Little Mokie, of course. Well guess that's something you two have in common, both big family men huh? Who'd have thought rich and famous Kaiba Seto would ever have anything in common with gutter trash Jounouchi right? Learning is fun, learning is fun. Okay, back to Jounouchi, what's number two on the list and for good measure tag three on with it as well. Gimmie your top three, what's most important for you little pup?'
((Went to the beach for a few days, so that was very nice. Bit stressed now about trying to see everyone I want to see/see again in about 10 more days though. There is just never enough vacation.
Yea, I can't imagine a plot where I'd sympathise with the Hulk part of the Hulk. I think he worked in the Avengers for me because obviously he could remain Bruce for the majority of it and not be a focal point, while super hero stuff could still happen via the other characters. I guess that's the thing for me though I don't know about necessarily generally, I tend to not have much interest in non-human characters. Well, not as in not human but as in not human like. So something like Lion King, people like lions, that's fine. I'm not trying to relate to the lion mentality I'm trying to relate to fury people. I don't imagine how I'd ever relate to Hulk because he's not human, and I'm not even sure it'd work to make him so. But that's in a lot of ways my thing, I'm a character-based personality versus plot-based. It goes back to why I don't like Iron Man so much, the characters do nothing for me and no matter how good the plot is nothing can ever make up for that lack. Conversely something can have a terrible plot but if there is at least one character I absolutely love it becomes watchable and many things become forgivable. I guess that's the problem for me, I can't imagine what plot would make the Hulk a likeable character for me. Of course that doesn't mean he can't work, I just don't think it'll ever work for me.))
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Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:51 am
Jounouchi knew this could be used against him in the future, but right now he was willing to do anything to stall time for Shizuka. And it wasn't like the spirit wouldn't be able to figure out new ways to torment him anyway with his answers; it showed that it obviously already knew what was important to Jounouchi by taking his sister.
So he barely bristled at the insults, trying to remain calm as he slowly relayed his answers, "...number two is my friends." that was an easy-enough answer, and the creature would already know it could hurt him through his friends to begin with. For the third, he had to think a moment on what it was, "...number three is doing good in the world. Being able to be useful somehow and benefit something." he finally said.
((Yeah, time always goes too quickly on vacation.
I'm really the same way, characters being my biggest focus, definitely more than plot. I think the difference with us here is that I do see the Hulk as human, and can see him as an interesting (not one of my favorites, but still interesting) character. I can see why that's not so doable with the movie-verse, but with how much I've read of him in comics, he is definitely his own being with his own personality. Just less intelligent and more emotional than your average person. As for Iron Man, though I did like the plot, it was still the characters that drove it for me. In this case I simply like Tony Stark, where's you don't, so that's all there is to that. XD))
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Kitsune Ketz Kwineight Captain
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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 11:31 am
'Aww, isn't that just sick. Alright, forget the numerical system, what do you want most for you? Give me a selfish desire, everyone has at least one. Don't pretend you don't. And don't lie to me, I'll know. Heh, as will Shizuka's pretty little kneecaps, hahaha.'
((Happy Easter!!! And yes, vacation time flies by way too fast.
I agree that I can see Hulk as a 'humanised' character in a written format, there are just a lot more character limitations in film. Best example I can think of is Twilight, which are books that are about 80% inner monologue. The closest I've seen the films come to achieving that effect is just to have the character dialogue thoughts over the background, the biggest failure was their attempt at 'hallucinations' and just having floaty people off to the side saying things. I mean it's hilarious but this isn't an intentionally hilarious franchise and I just can't imagine it working. Somehow I do think films have a better shot at a relatable Hulk than at making a successful visual rendition of the inner monologue, but they are both difficult tasks. Especially if they try to pull ideas from writing, because writing obviously has so much more freedom in certain ways than films do.
And yea, rich man slut "philanthropist" so I can justify continually being a d**k definitely is not someone I can easily like (going with 'relationship' after the first film is probably something that helps me more in the later films, even if he does still refer to himself as a playboy clearly in the film-verse that's a persona he's shed by film two). He's a hyped up sexified version of the kind of people I hate most in the world right now and I just can't suspend disbelief and get past that unfortunately. I think years earlier I probably would have found the character, particularly Downey Jr, a bit charming. But the past few years when I started getting into these films (I only started watching in Spring of 2012 around when the Avengers was about to come out) has coincided with watching rich white men actively work to cut down the middle class; fight against the rights of women, minorities and LGBTQ individuals; fight against healthcare and education; etc etc. Rich guy who justifies his lifestyle with no recognition of how over-privileged he is by cutting a check, and invests primarily in military expenditures, yea I just can't get past it enough to just enjoy an alternate universe. Maybe if I hit a point in life where I'm less angry and bitter I can reevaluate the character, but right now Tony is representative of things that make me so miserable these days. He's just the worst. stressed ))
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Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 3:58 pm
Jounouchi grit his teeth, having to hold back his retort at first. He wanted to threaten the thing, warning it not to touch Shizuka. He wanted to say his selfish desire was seeing this damn ghost go ******** off. But satisfying his anger and pride was not worth putting his sister into danger, so he considered again, answering honestly, "...I want to become a world-famous duelist. Be successful enough doing something I love that I can move out and not have to worry about money."
It wasn't something that was too difficult to admit. Jounouchi knew there were better duelists than him, but it wasn't like he hadn't already been proclaiming his dream of being a 'true duelist' in the past. It just took changing that to 'world famous' to seem selfish enough.
((Happy Easter! Haha I slept in and missed my whole family get-together. XD
Oh god Twilight. I've only seen the first movie, but I definitely liked it better than the books. I don't necessarily think inner monologing is a bad writing choice. I think it is a more difficult writing choice that requires extremely interesting characters to pull off well, which Twilight certainly does not. So the books were just way too boring to me with that writing style, and though the movies tried to capture it, in failing to do so I thought it became more interesting. XD I agree humanizing Hulk would be easier than an inner monologue movie. The Planet Hulk animated movie and the Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes TV series managed to do a decent job in my opinion, at least better than the movies. Granted they also made him talk more and more intelligent in those.
Haha, I know, we've been over this before. I agree with you about how sickening those type of people are in our world, but I think for me, I have a difficult time hating even the worst people. I still feel like it would be better to get them to 'see the light,' and that they still have the potential to be good people. That's probably why I like Tony so much. He starts off as someone that is just sickening and terrible and represents so much of the bad, privileged people in the world, but he learns how wrong his company and his lifestyle are, little by little. He stops manufacturing weapons in Iron Man, he learns to have a steady relationship in Iron Man 2, he realizes he is willing to sacrifice himself for the sake of others in Avengers, and he learns how to live humbly and work hard with very little in Iron Man 3. Granted, he still has a long way to go in the movieverse, but in the comic world he ends up becoming one of the most hardworking, self-sacrificing heroes. He loses the friendship and respect of most of his friends for the sake of bringing the best possible, least-violent end to the Civil War, making himself the bad guy to save everyone else from having to do so. He devotes his company and all of his technology to superheroing, alternative energy solutions, funding the Avengers, and improving world technology, and on multiple occasions loses everything trying to do what's right. He barely sleeps or does anything for himself because he spreads himself through SHIELD, the Avengers, United States and world politics, charity... currently he is out in space trying to work out problems there, and has an armor on Earth that he can control when he is needed there too. Now, he still has some of that 'Tony' personality, sleeping around, drinking problems (though he's been sober a long time now), being extremely into himself, but he knows when to be serious and how to be a hero. Granted, movie Tony is still a child compared to comic Tony, but I feel like he is on his way, slowly, to become that kind of man. His is a story of redemption and constant self-improvement to me, and that is something I can support in any person. The more people seeking those things, no matter their past crimes, the better the world can become. But at the same time I totally understand where you're coming from and why you would find him repulsive. XD I wonder though, do you not feel the same way about Kaiba because you were in a different place in life when you got introduced to him? I mean, he constantly tried to use his money and power to make the world revolve around Duel Monsters, the biggest focus of his toy company, as well as to make himself the greatest duelist with the best deck. XD))
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Kitsune Ketz Kwineight Captain
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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 5:06 pm
Seto had a plan, and unfortunately a good deal of it required not cluing Jounouchi in, he just wasn't a very good actor and the situation was too dire to take the risk. Hopefully this strategy wouldn't backfire on them now, and hopefully, he'd forgive him if they all got out of this alive. So before Anzu or the spirit could reply Seto chimed in with a sneer, 'you a world-famous duelist? Like that would happen.'
The next comment died on Anzu's plump lips while Jounouchi had the chance to confront Kaiba. Apparently still enemies to the bitter end, this would be fun.
((Haha, I don't have much family to get together so no missing that. Are you sad you missed the get-together or are you happier that you just slept?
Heh, it was interesting, but not in the way I think they were intending. Talking probably helps, communication in some form is probably a big part of relating to something. I mean maybe it'd just be more about shifting away from the adjustment period balancing Hulk/Bruce time and just move forward past the control issue. I mean Avengers kind of ending suggested he's got this, soooo can we move forward? Maybe? Perhaps he just needs to not be a 'monster' and just be a character.
Yea, and that probably contributes to me being one of the people who prefers the third and then second movie over the first by a great deal. I wish I was less hateful, I think living abroad has shifted that as well. The British are very negative. xd I definitely have thought about that, and I think I love Seto still now because I have loved him for years, but yea I definitely don't think if I was getting into the series now he'd be my favourite character. I mean maybe, he is still kinda negative and isolated and he certainly doesn't have everything going for him (I'm quite sure he's not getting laid/formulating successful relationships). Tony gets everything he wants (in the film verse) within about 10 minutes. He wants all the girls he has them, he wants a serious relationship bam, the girl he likes can't resist him. I mean I do like that he's at least happy, people who have it all can't sit around complaining, but that doesn't make it any less irritating. I definitely still do think if I had discovered Seto now/over the past few years I wouldn't like him as much (nor Pegasus, who used to be my second favourite character though Bakura did knock him down a peg several years ago), but he's not loved, he has a hard time with all types of relationships, he's an orphan. He's got enough stacked against him that he wouldn't totally bug me, even if I might not love him the same.))
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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 12:55 pm
Jounouchi froze, just for a moment leaving this horrifying situation, and going back to the much simpler confrontations he was used to. It didn't last though; before he even had time to give his usual response, he remembered what their situation was right now. And instead of feeling just the typical anger and frustration at Kaiba's cruel comments, he felt shock, disgust, and even betrayal. How could Kaiba go back to his stupid, pointless mocking in such a dire situation? Was he really that desperate to put others down, even at their worst moments? When other peoples' lives were on the line?
A deep feeling of hate boiled up in Jounouchi's gut. He turned to Kaiba, all of the respect and humanizing he had slowly been building for the other washing away in that one look, "What the hell is wrong with you? I know you don't give a s**t about anyone but you and your brother, but dammit all, Shizuka and Anzu are in danger and all you can think of is insulting me?!"
((I'm more happy that I didn't have to wake up early just to have to deal with all the family members I don't like. XD My mom would be offended if I just chose not to go, but this way I got out of it.
Yeah, I could definitely see that being another idea that could work. Instead of Bruce and Hulk needing to learn to balance control, they just need to learn to work together and, you know, actually be able to stand each other.
Haha, oh those negative Brits. Fair enough as far as your feelings on Kaiba go. He did have a lot more hardship than Tony, and he probably is a virgin. XD I think he's done a lot more bad in the world, but you're coming from a stance that even though he currently has a lot of privilege, he used to have nothing, right? I also did not like how easily Tony and Pepper got together. That was one thing that just seemed too cliche and simple. It's interesting how our opinions on characters change/would be different. Like with Yuu Yuu Hakusho, I used to detest Kuwabara in the dub anime. When I read the manga a long time later though, I was like, "Oh, he's not so bad." then as I kept going, I liked him more and more to the point where he became my second-favorite character and I started shipping him with my favorite. XD))
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Kitsune Ketz Kwineight Captain
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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:07 pm
Seto actually felt terrible, and strangely enough, primarily because Jounouchi had so readily believed him. So much for truce and trust. He supposed he shouldn't let it bother him, as soon as they managed to get out of this situation it's not like they'd ever willing be spending time together again. Still...
Pushing his thoughts aside he focused on the task at hand, finding Anzu and luring her close enough to be able to draw the spirit out of her. He was banking on both the distraction of an argument and the fact the spirit shouldn't expect them to have had enough know-how or time yet to come here prepared. Most importantly of course, he would need the two items he'd managed to deftly nick from Futata before they stormed off to work, especially as he was only sure of what one of them did. Something he'd taken while wandering around the temple while Jounouchi did most of the talking. He'd at least read the placard accompanying that. The second item Futata had given to him wordlessly in the brief half a second before she moved away. He really hoped it was what his quick research while setting up the translation project suggested it might be. It's not like they had a lot of options though. Subtly dropping the bait he kept his focus on Jounouchi, on keeping him angry and centre of attention. That would also help lure the shikigami near, this particular type of spirit should love all that negative energy.
'Oh sorry, I have this terrible habit of thinking allowed when I hear bullshit. Though you're right this really just is not the time for that, but come on, there had to have been at least a realistic answer you could have gone for? I mean what about mechanic or plumber? Those both pay well and are probably more your speed.'
- - -
Oh ha, what fun. Silently Anzu jumped down from the trees and crept a bit closer. Clearly these two were too busy tearing at each other to notice if their antagonist pulled up a closer seat to enjoy the show. Hopefully it would get violent, nothing was more delicious than spilled blood.
((Well sounds like a win-win then.
He's definitely been more 'hostile' but not necessarily on a global scale. I mean most of the things he does targets specific people and aren't really 'bad for the world' as a whole. So yea Tony's intentions are better, but yea, what a tool. xd And yea the relationship (the magical ease of it particularly) is probably the most irksome part, even if it is simultaneously making him a bit more bearable as a person. But yea him actually having to maybe work hard for more than 30 seconds to achieve something, especially someone to love his obnoxious butt, would definitely have added some depth to that. And yea, barring series that have a very limited character set I probably would have different favourites across many. I definitely hated Kuwabara when I watched the anime at like 12, but when I started reading it (though sadly never finished, nor finished the anime, both things I really want to do one day) I definitely appreciated him more as a character as well.))
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Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:06 pm
Jounouchi's face reddened, clenching his fists. He held himself back from going after Kaiba, still too worried about Shizuka to fully take his attention away from her.
He was about to tell Kaiba to just go ******** off if he only cared about being an a*****e in this type of situation, but remembered that the spirit wanted them both here. "Does it matter?!? The thing told me to be honest and selfish, not realistic, so I was!! Now do all of us a favor and just shut the ******** up with your insults for once!!"
((Yeah, I think globally Kaiba actually improved the world, but it's still hard to applaud him for that when he tormented and tried to kill so many people out of a petty need to win. XD I think it would be better if for now Tony and Pepper stopped working out, and he had to find himself in a place where he could try to get her back, try to find another steady relationship, or go back to sleeping around. It would make him value a companion more if he really had to work for the first two options. Poor Kuwabara. He seems like the character that all the child fans tend to hate. XD))
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Kitsune Ketz Kwineight Captain
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JuokasKurvas Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 5:57 pm
Seto stepped closer, towering over Jounouchi in a way he knew he hated. 'Make me,' he smirked, shoving Jounouch in the chest and pushing him backwards a bit. Steadily he was trying to prod Jounouchi closer to where Shizuka was tied up, even if he now was pretty sure the shikigami was behind them. It'd be best to have four of them as close together as possible. He shoved Jounouchi again as the first time he kind of just staggered and glared.
((I don't know if them breaking up and getting back together would feel like much to me at this point. It'd feel more like cheap stunt trying to look like the character development they forgot to put in than honest character development. I think for it to work they'd have to do a lot more to establish Pepper as an independent character who cares about something other than Tony, because I think that's the big problem. Right now she revolves around Tony and it's hard to believably see them splitting b/c she wants to, which would then just look like Tony got bored with another plaything.
Children probably only saw him as the bully and didn't really get to appreciate the depth until they were old enough to understand that most people have a few more dimensions to them than just bully/victim.))
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