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A friendly guild for any and all types of Yuugiou: Duel Monsters fans. 

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JuokasKurvas
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 4:00 am


'Yea sure, I'm fine. I had a feeling that something was up but I just never would have guessed it would be this. Hmm, Hirutani, what do you know about what he is up to do these days anyhow?' Honda asked, wondering what exactly they were getting into.

((Haha, I wouldn't rewatch Iron Man on my opinion. I mean my bf is with you and totally finds it amazing, judges me harshly for liking the second one better, etc etc. I think it's just more different tastes in terms of what makes a good movie, even though we have similar genre interests. I think we are both character based people but like different kinds of characters. I think I'll probably end up feeling the same with a re-watch of Captain America that you did with Iron Man. However, I can say after watching the Green Lantern I can appreciate the many ways in which Iron Man is such a better movie even if it's not to my tastes. I mean, I won't tell you to not give Green Lantern a watch just to have seen it, but I will be surprised if you do come back having enjoyed it as I feel it takes the worst elements of Thor (poorly developed romantic interest being too important to the plot being the biggest problem) and then tosses in bad CGI, a script that doesn't know where it's going, and just too much sitting around and talking about boring s**t nobody cares about (generally the complaint Phantom Menace suffers the most, but this is so much worse).

The comic storyline sounds interesting, I always debate trying to get into comics so it's kind of hard to know where to begin, but I do live near a fairly decent comic store that I'm in quite frequently (because it also has games, movies/anime, manga and fantasy books as well as overpriced memorabilia I'd never buy but is fun to look at) so I hedge more and more lately. Most of the online series I've been following have been such s**t lately that maybe I need to move out of hipster comics and into something more 'main stream' wink

I don't know how I feel about female Thor not being a comic fan. My brain immediately kind of screams they couldn't come up with a decent female character that would draw a strong audience on its own so we'll re-appropriate an existing male character. I mean from what I've heard they are at least going about this the best possible way, but I dunno.

See I didn't feel Gamora was very kind at all, I thought she was the most moral but her morality was more toward the 'ends justify the means' which I find is always a huge conflict for nice/voice of reason. I think she's probably the character I could have liked/cared about the most with 'more' (I happen to really like ends justify the means people even if they tend to border insane/evil/violent most of the time/eventually), and I feel potentially if the Guardians stick around she'll eventually become someone I like quite a bit. Depending on where they go with Guardians and her story wise now at any rate. While I really like Groot and its between him and Star-Lord for me, in the long run I think he'll be a bit stunted to have the same kind of depth and development as someone who can say more than 4 words. Although ugh, boyfriend ruined everything last night mentioning 'that aren't flowers part of a plants reproductive system, so what does that mean when Groot gave that little girl his flower?' He's not quite right but still, how could he go there?!? xd ))
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:51 pm


"Well... nothing." Jounouchi admitted. "That's part of the reason we're going to find him. His gang seemingly disbanded after the whole yo-yo thing, so we're going in cautious, but not with a huge amount of backup for now."

((Yeah, but it had been a while and I felt like rewatching it too, so having a new way to look at the film gave me an excuse to rewatch it. XD I will definitely be surprised if I come back having enjoyed Green Lantern too. The only superhero movie I'm expecting to be worse than it is Cat Woman, because that was the biggest pile of s**t I've ever seen. Speaking of Star Wars while we're on the topic of Guardians: http://cheezburger.com/8286676224

If you're curious about starting on comics, a good idea might be to find a character you really like that has an ongoing series. Currently there's a Hawkeye, Black Widow, Nightcrawler, Storm, and Magneto series, though Hawkeye might've finished by now. It gives you more character investment without having to divide focus on a whole team, plus they usually don't have the complex end of the world plot lines, and start with their own side story that's easy to follow. Marvel comics are also really good at giving you enough info to understand references to other events and such. Then you'll probably inevitably find a character/reference to a storyline/team/situation that interests you enough to look into it, then you find another comic series that revolves around that to start, and it just keeps expanding from there. I'm still going through that process, constantly learning about the universe and finding new and old series or arcs to read. Another idea is if you're wanting to read more into the full universe, read the major event books. Modern Marvel events started with Avengers Disassembled and kind of ends that 'era' at Avengers VS X-Men. Since then they've done Age of Ultron, Battle of the Atom (more for X-Men than the full universe), Infinity, Inhumanity, and are currently doing Original Sin, which all tend to stand better on their own than being connected like the last ten years of Marvel events (except Infinity and Inhumanity are completely connected and follow one after the other, Infinity also being the event I was just talking about with Ronan). Events tend to be from five-ten issues for the full story, really show you the place of most main groups of the Marvel Universe, define how characters and teams end up where they are during their ongoing series, and if you find a character or team in the event that really interests you, their ongoing series will have bonus, side material going more in depth of their involvement in the event. But anyway, if you try for the events, I suggest doing the big ten-year 'era' of the new millennium first. Events for that are, in this order: Avengers Disassembled, House of M (my favorite), Civil War, The Initiative, World War Hulk, Secret Invasion, Dark Reign, Siege, and Avengers VS X-Men.

I kind of felt that way for a moment too, but thinking about it, Marvel's already tried creating tons of new interesting female characters, but no one ever has any interest in them. It's a mixture of Marvel's old code of comics and the current fanbase that makes it really hard for them to do diversity. No one wants new characters anymore, so they just have to replace the old white male ones with women and persons of color and hopefully LGBT persons at some point. So while I'd prefer Marvel releasing more big tier female characters instead of replacing the big tier male characters with them, I can see why they're doing it, and prefer it as a diversity strategy over doing nothing at so they can maximize profit. I'm certainly not offended at the idea of a female Thor, just wish it didn't have to come to that in the first place. As for Falcon being the new Cap, though I'm sad to see Steve Rogers go, I actually like Sam Wilson more than him, so am pretty ecstatic. XD

Compared to the Gamora I've known, she was very kind. The fact that she seemed to always be the first wanting to take caution and save people and such, that just seemed odd to me. Then again, that role wouldn't really fit with any of the Guardians except maybe Groot, but he doesn't particularly have the vocabulary to take it too easily. I'm just bothered they stuck it not only with the girl, but with 'the most dangerous woman in the galaxy.' I could see her being sickened by Thanos and wanting to stop him/get revenge, but it seemed a little too quick and easy that she threw off all his conditioning and was parading to be the hero most of all the characters. I like her ends justify the means mentality, but not so much how many heroic means she has. As for Groot, I was pleased and surprised with how much depth they gave him. I saw an interview with Vin Diesel saying he would do like fifteen takes and the executives would say it was perfect, but then he'd ask for twenty more to give the character as much depth and emotion as he could possibly convey. I have confidence they can keep portraying that. Hahaha, thinking about it it was pretty much like giving the girl his sex organs. XD))

Kitsune Ketz Kwineight
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JuokasKurvas
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2014 4:58 am


'Why would he be doing this to you? Why now?' Honda asked, the number of questions increasing as he dwelt on the issue.

((I am Groot! Heh, cute. Hmm, now I'm in this horrible position where I feel I need to re-watch Catwoman. I thought it was s**t when I saw it, but that was one time in 2004 on a very awkward movie date with my now gay ex-boyfriend (and things are much less awkward) and now I'm not sure if I think it is worse than Green Lantern. I mean I remember thinking it was stupid, but was it exceedingly dull and incoherent? Did it really do an even worse job of character development, I mean bad characters would still beat the cardboard people that make up the cast of Green Lantern (there is one character in GL, named Tom, who I almost like but again they didn't develop him more than anyone else). Damn, the bf is saying we can watch Daredevil instead, but I feel like while I won't like it I still expect it to beat Lantern, but Catwoman? Oh noes, dilemma!

I think I'll probably start character based as I think to get into things more by attaching to a character than a story usually, but I'll have to think about what character. And yea I agree that Marvel is really going with the best option for their existing fan base. Hopefully if they can diversify tastes enough they can then move on to big female and LGBT characters who stand on their own origins rather than pre-existing white male ones. I'm definitely not offended by female Thor but I think I like male Thor and would miss male Thor if he was someone I followed in comics (which makes me think Thor is not who I'll be going with sadly), but obviously if female Thor competed with male Thor should probably just get ignored and shunted to the side in favour of male Thor. Anyhow, will maybe take a closer look at what is on offer at that shop I go to and go from there.

I don't have a Gamora to compare with so that probably makes a difference in how a view her. I do feel the film fell into the midway between background and really getting to see the characters out of a thrust - kind of zany - situation, so I'm not too bothered by any of them at the moment as they feel sort of 'in progress' but in a way that worked for me within the context of this film. I would like to see more of the 'killing machine' she protested being turned into though, but I was okay with it not being in the movie probably because I am not at all familiar with her - or any of the guardians - prior to this. Vin Diesel is a giant nerd and supposedly had the time of his life doing this, lol, it's weird he doesn't look like someone who would be in films I like but he does creep into a few.))
PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:17 pm


Jounouchi shook his head, "I'm not sure. Maybe he just discovered his lineage or something. Maybe he was preparing this whole time. The guy does not drop a grudge easily."

((Obviously I cannot compare Catwoman to Green Lantern since I haven't seen the ladder. I will say the characters were just plain bad. Fairly cardboardy, but had enough just awfulness to make them not completely dull. The story was also just WTF. As for Daredevil, it's been a while, but I remember it just being completely white bread. Exactly fulfilled the 'needs' of a superhero movie with absolutely nothing more to it, so it was exceedingly boring. Except Bullseye. He was pretty tight, even though he didn't hold a candle to his comic counterpart. Bullseye makes everything better. Also you should totally read Dark Reign at some point now that I'm thinking about it, because baddies replace the Avengers, and Bullseye becomes the new Hawkeye, while Wolverine's son becomes the new Wolverine. Then Wolverine's son proceeds to hit on Bullseye while manipulating his pheromones and tormenting him. It was pure gold. XD

When I listed current character comics, I was an idiot and didn't even thing to list the 'mainstream' ones that are always going. So of course there's Cap, Thor, Iron Man, Hulk, and Wolverine. Plus there's old ones and probably current ones I forgot. I would just think of a few of your favorite movie characters and look up to see if they have a series, old or new. You can find virtually anything on Amazon, and comic stores often have old issues. I was just at one that had the whole Falcon four-issue series for $8 and the Vision and Scarlet Witch 12-issue for $12, both of which are old school. I was very happy. One word of warning though. I wouldn't start with the Hawkeye series. It's very... different, and doesn't give you a good idea of what Marvel comics are like. It's not bad, just very artsy and focuses more on Clint and his personal problems rather than fighting or anything. Also the characters feel extremely flat to me, but a lot of l people like it and say it's just part of the artistic style.

Yes, I hope eventually fans become more open to new characters. I mean the closest they've done so far with some degree of success is the new Ms. Marvel. The original became Captain Marvel, and was replaced with a completely new Muslim character. Yes, she still had to take an old title, but otherwise her personality, origin, powers, and everything are completely different. She's pretty awesome, but it isn't like her comics have been flying off the shelves. As for male Thor, I like him and like having him on the team, but he's never been one of my absolute favorites, and he's had so many series and been in so much, I'm really just kind of tired of him for now, and welcome a breath of fresh air.

Yeah, I wonder how much my view of movie Gamora was twisted because of comic Gamora. She felt rushed and over-redeemed to me, but is that because I'm used to her more chaotic comic persona, or actual bad movie development? I can't tell. But anyway, as for the 'in progress' thing, that's how I definitely felt about Drax, where's compared to the others, Gamora seemed to make 'too much progress.' Vin Diesel is surprisingly awesome, even though Fast and Furious is just ugh. XD))

Kitsune Ketz Kwineight
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 7:27 am


Honda went quiet and the conversation dropped off until they got to the mansion. Parking Seto led the trio into the house, he paused when he got to the kitchen. Honda and Jounouchi both looked at him expectantly, but silently. Unable to take the quiet anymore he finally asked, 'well, I'll have back up around the place - as soon as we find out where we are going. First though, how unarmed do we want to go in, and if we don't, how trained with arms are you two?'

((I'm not entirely sure the Green Lantern characters even had enough awfulness to keep them from being completely dull, they were just completely dull. The bad guy - well, not Parallax but I forgot his name, I wanna say it's Howard - he was okay, but he's handled so erratically and really only 'well developed' in the sense that his type is obvious that you can guess his feelings and motivations rather than the movie actually shows/develops them, so I still couldn't call him a redeeming character. I expected as much of Daredevil which is what puts me off it. I mean I at least could kind of hope Green Lantern was that bad movie that might be enjoyable in some sense for how bad it is, whereas Daredevil probably will just be a straightforward film that might feel like a waste of time at the end. At least there is something to say in how bad Green Lantern is. Will keep Dark Reign in mind but for later.

I did generally figure mainstream characters would definitely be a thing so no worries about not listing them. I probably wouldn't start with Hawkeye anyhow as from filmverse alone he isn't doing a lot for me to want to look into him more. It'd probably be Cap, Thor and Black Widow that I'd be more interested in out of current film Avengers. I'm more familiar with X-men and once upon a time did sift through a few comics because I had a friend who was a big X comic fan (but this was pretty close to two decades ago and at the time just didn't get into it - man I am old). Debated buying the Loki Agent of Asgard comics last time I was in shop but wasn't sure and didn't. Might do some research and have a look through Amazon as I do have about £100 left in Amazon vouchers kicking about. I can't think of a practical use for them (just slowly been chipping at it with things like present buying, I had more like £200+ at first, my uni really loves to give Amazon vouchers away for participation/involvement in projects and studies. So bought a portable hard drive and that was kind of it for practical things I wanted/needed that I could get on Amazon as my landlord kind of won't take them in place of rent. So while I don't love Amazon (big corporation, evades taxes, has killed most bookstores back home and put other businesses I've liked under) I do have the vouchers and atm it's easier to justify using them then using 'real' money.

I guess the big thing for female Thor is she going to merely just be Thor with boobs, and/or will her differences be something more than stereotypical female elements? Because as long as they avoid that I think maybe it'd be okay to shelve male Thor, even if he is one of my favourite characters. I think it was more just of a 'hmm, I'm debating trying to get into comics and Thor seems like the likely place I'd start and oh hey big changes to the character and now maybe that isn't the best place for me to start.' Atm though I'm re-reading Ouran Host Club and haven't read manga in forever. However, was in a mood and watched the whole anime again this weekend (made Tom watch it and he actually liked it) but I never read the last 4-5 volumes of the manga. I can't really figure out where I left off so I've decided to just start over.

Heh, I've never seen any of the Fast Franchise, not my thing, but I do like Riddick, particularly Pitch Black. So it's not surprising to find that I can like him within the context of his less typical film genres.))
PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 12:25 pm


"I'm best with my fists, but I can handle a knife." Jounouchi replied, seeming slightly uncomfortable with the idea, "Only guns I've used were arcade ones... and those blaster things you made us use in Death T. Though I was pretty good with them."

((Ugh, sounds like the perfect amount of boredom then. And yeah, Daredevil and even Elektra were super boring, I hardly remember their personalities or if they even had any. I mean... Elektra is a deadly assassin without a lot of morals, yet they somehow made her a typical, sweet love interest who just happened to be good at some fighting.

Granted Hawkeye is way more interesting in comics. He's no where near as quiet. Actually quite the loudmouth, making wisecracks and constantly questioning authority. He and Cap have a great relationship, because at first they joined the team at the same time, and Cap was put in charge of their squad (which also included Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver), and Hawkeye questioned and fought him for so long about it. Then they finally gained a mutual respect and friendship, and for a while when Cap 'died,' everyone wanted Hawkeye to take his mantle, but he refused. Black Widow and Loki are two on my to-read list, as they've just put the first issues on Marvel Unlimited, so I can't give an opinion, but have heard really good things about both of them. Cap and Thor have so many series you can start wherever you want. Just look up their list with some descriptions on Wikipedia and see what interests you the most. Sounds good with Amazon. I don't like them either, but man they are so convenient. You can also buy individual issues or a lot of series have omnibuses. That's cool you got vouchers though. I ended up with a $100 Amazon gift card recently from taking online surveys. I'm going to use it to upgrade my drawing tablet from cheapest of the cheap to the best non-professional version. =)

Yeah, I really hope she has a different personality, purpose, and origin than Thor. It's kind of weird that they're even calling her Thor, since that's his actual name. But I've read it will involve the original Thor, that she'll be really mysterious and he'll be trying to figure out who she is and where she came from, so that seems interesting. I would start with an older Thor series that already has a good track record though, since this is so new and unknown. Oh, I miss Host Club. I should give the manga a shot too, though I've been told it gets worse after the point where the anime ends. Too dramatic apparently.

Fast definitely isn't my thing either, though neither is Riddick. Too much action without enough plot for me.))

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2014 2:01 pm


'Well, I can equip us with whatever you want,' Seto said bluntly, 'so it's more about how you think we should go in. You know this guy, is he likely to be armed and if so with what? Is it likely to come to a fist fight or is it going to escalate beyond that? I just don't want to walk into a situation where we inadvertently brought fists to a gun fight, or even to a knife fight.'

((Yea I did see Elektra just because I was sitting in the room while friends were watching it and that was a pile of s**t, but still potentially better than Green Lantern, it had fewer characters so I think it still managed to develop them more than GL did. GL just had so many characters and just didn't do anything with any of them. I think Lantern had more potential than Elektra but I think it screwed up a lot more.

I like Hawkeye's line in Thor (the first one) and he doesn't seem like someone I wouldn't like but don't have much on him now and in terms of his talent set I'm not overly thrilled, but yea I can't imagine him not being better in the comics as he's barely in the film series thus far. Yea they are way convenient, and even more convenient as a gift option to provide an incentive that isn't just handing over money so I can't really avoid Amazon I just wish they weren't pushing other businesses out of business so hard as obviously Amazon will never need the amount of man power to equal the amount of jobs they are destroying. And smaller businesses and even some larger companies obviously pay more into taxes and do more for individuals than Amazon ever could. But yea, too convenient.

Yea I definitely wouldn't start with the new thing, and yea where I left off in the manga it was way more intense and I think that's kind of why I fell off it. I really like the tone of the anime and first half of the manga, but I kind of want to know where it goes and yea definitely in the mood for it. Plus as I've started at the beginning again I won't just jump into the drama but go through the bits I loved too. It's been so long and the manga has more than the anime even where they are the same. I've been hedging on reading volume 8 and 9 of Loveless but there was like 3 years between when volume 7 came out and 8 did and I've now forgotten 1-7 so feel I have to re-read them. 1-7 are on my shelf in the states though not here, and I could read them online but I feel like if I own something I should actually read the copies I've paid money for. So Host Club it is! Maybe it'll get me back into the comic vein and then I can figure out where to go with American comics and perhaps Loveless. It really has been awhile though as I started reading it the wrong way at first, though I think because my brain is a bit thrown off by hitting the right direction button to turn the page (because I'm reading it online that's how it's set up) but then needing to read left.

Pitch Black isn't as high on the action as Chronicles (which is my least favourite) or Riddick (less action then Chronicles but also less plot and character development than Pitch Black) but it is closer to the horror genre (survival horror, guess kid of Alien-esque though out in the open more) than the other two. I do like the universe and story around the franchise though and definitely would like to see more background stuff and more of the tone of the original or even Into Pitch Black (though that was way low budget and suffered heavily in terms of character, acting and just general atmosphere from that).
PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:36 pm


"It's possible he could've gotten ahold of a gun, but he's never had one before. Definitely would have a knife at least, and maybe a taser." Jounouchi shivered as he remembered the latter weapon, "I'd say we should each have a knife as backup." he would probably not use one himself, but decided it was smartest to have one on him just in case,"Then probably something non-lethal. What about a stun gun or a pistol with rubber bullets?" he looked to Kaiba, "Do you know how to use either?"

((Oh, I didn't actually see the Elektra movie, I was just talking about her as a character in Daredevil. XD That's another one on my need-to-watch-but-don't-want-to.

Hawkeye's arrows are also way more interesting in comics. They do all kinds of things besides just normal and exploding. He has freezing ones, ones that trap people in goo, fire ones, tracking ones, electrical ones, acid, boomerang, sonic, smoke, nets, flares, and even one with usb drives on them so he can shook them into a computer port and corrupt it from afar. Plus he's amazing at hand-to-hand combat and often uses like flying scooters and stuff on missions. He's also the only character I've seen so far who never seems to get annoyed with Deadpool, and actually gets along with and encourages his zaniness. Even the few friends Deadpool has are always exasperated with him.

You're kind of making me want to get back into manga, haha. I'd definitely give Host Club a read. Also reminds me I've been waiting for years to finish Yami no Matsuei and Okane ga Nai. Wonder if they ever came off hiatus. Never was able to get into Loveless myself, but I only watched the terrible and confusing anime with a completely unsatisfactory ending that didn't answer any questions, so if the manga's better I'd give it a shot. Kind of hated the characters though. Sometimes I read so many Japanese online comics (just little one or two-page ones) on Pixiv I start reading right-to-left on English comics. XD

Yeah, just overall not my series.))

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 5:40 am


Seto smirked at the question, and lead them to a room at the very back of the basement, well past the entertainment center that Mokuba had enthralled Jounouchi with a few days earlier. He entered a code when he reached the room he wanted, a code only he knew with a lock type that would be a nightmare to break through if Seto were to die unexpectedly. Still, he'd never want to risk Mokuba getting in here. The door opened and Seto flicked on the lights to reveal a sizable arms warehouse in the basement of his home.

There were shelves filled with guns of all types, knives and swords and other bladed weapons, a table with various tasers and stun guns, and that was just what could be seen from the front of the room. 'Well,' he answered, 'I can use anything we have in here.'

((Well Tom has said Elektra is worse than Daredevil, as I haven't seen DD I can only comment on her in Elektra, which isn't going to be favorably.

I do tend to really like archers but never in modern series, but we'll see how he develops in the filmverse and maybe I'll give him a fairer shot later down the line.

I loved the anime for Yami no Matsuei but I remember how you said the manga was on hiatus so I didn't start it. I did hear awhile back that they had started up again but from a quick google I can only find information in regards to a magazine serialization so don't know if it continued very far if they still haven't collected it into further manga. I started Okane ga Nai but I stopped for some reason without finishing it, I no longer remember why. Can't remember if that one was in progress when I started reading it. Loveless the anime answers nothing, though I do like it mostly in terms of getting to watch parts of the manga. Even the manga was only starting to explain things around volume 6 or 7? Which is why it was frustrating that there was such a long hiatus when Tokyopop when under as it was majorly confusing/cliff hanger like. Viz finally picked it up like 3 years later. I like a lot of the characters but I don't like the main character, Ritsuka, or Yuiko (the pink haired girl whose in love with Ritsuka). Despite this I still really got into the story but yes it's way confusing and you are definitely going to have to sign on in the beginning for confusion and irritating main characters. I can let you know further down the line if it comes together enough that you might be able to get past that because it has only started to 'get to the point' around where I left off 4+ years ago. The anime does have a very unsatisfactory ending, apparently it was supposed to be 'open ended' in case they wanted to make more as the manga progressed. Though a lot of series do that and few ever make more (some launch a new series instead) so I doubt they will, so I wish they'd done more what Host Club did, and come up with their own end that worked with the tone of the anime rather than a very ambiguous end that didn't actually end the series in any meaningful way if they didn't make more.))
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 8:54 pm


Jounouchi's eyes widened as he looked over the arms room. He'd never seen so many weapons in one place, "...is this even legal?" he asked dumbly. It wasn't like he himself ever took much care to obey the law, and he knew Kaiba had used his money to perform many illegal activities in the past. Still, he was curious.

((By the way, I rewatched Guardians today. I paid close attention to Ronan, and also tried to view Gamora with fresh eyes, now that I knew she wouldn't fulfill my comic characterization expectations. We were both right on Ronan. At the beginning he said he wouldn't forgive the Kree for the damage they had done in the war and for killing his ancestors. However, he also said things like how he followed old Kree tradition where they slaughter those who do not follow their culture, and near the end said the Xandarians had false gods or something to that effect. He definitely specifically insulted their gods. As for Gamora, while her occasional self-righteous attempts to convince the others to do the right thing got on my nerves, she grew on me to the point where I now like her more than Drax. He just doesn't have enough to him for me to latch onto; I merely enjoy his role and presence. Rocket also grew on me more, so he's shifted above Peter to my second favorite.

Yami no Matsuei was very similar to Host Club, where the anime was amazing and ended at the perfect place, but in the manga, after the point where the anime ended, it went down hill. However, it was more the opposite in that it lost the wonderful darkness the series already had, become more standard fantasy, where's Host Club apparently became too dark. I checked a couple years ago about the manga and had read something similar, that it had done a tiny continuation in a magazine but then went back to hiatus, so looks like no progress on that front. As for Okane ga Nai, I used to adore it back when I was first getting into yaoi and such. It was the first hard core series I actually liked the characters and plot in, and it didn't feel like it was nothing but porn. However, after some maturation, distancing myself from liking typical anime tropes, and a lot of feminist education, I'm kind of afraid to try it again and that I'd hate it now. I mean, the two main characters fit strongly into the extreme seme and uke roles, and it definitely glorifies rape and Stockholm Syndrome. I feel like I've also outgrown the 'anatomically incorrect but pretty' art style that so many manga have, and the art was one thing I always adored about the series. But I shouldn't avoid something I used to love; I should find out how I now stand on it. I still have all the manga that was out when I was reading it, so I should start it over and see how far it's continued. Haha, yeah, I think the only character I liked at all was the girl who wore fake ears. XD But if you end up finding it gets better, let me know and I'll give it a shot. I think I am going to try to get more into manga again. I'm going to start with one I downloaded recently that 4Chan recommended, because it's apparently extremely dark, which I'm in the mood for. Then I'll probably look into Okane ga Nai and Yami no Matsuei again, and go to Host Club from there. I do think Host Club anime found the perfect solution to ending early though, with a plot that felt nice and resolved, but is still in a place where it could easily pick up and continue with a new series.))

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:30 am


'Strictly speaking, no, so breathe a word of this to anyone and shikigami aren't going to be the only thing coming after you,' Seto said with a cheerful grin. Frankly, while he could probably get away with a lot of this just by the sheer amount of money he had to throw at the right people, some items in this room might earn him a sentence even he couldn't buy his way out of. The media backlash would also likely be quite damaging for both his personal and corporate reputation. Up until now there were only two other individuals who had some idea of the extent of what was in this room, though they had never seen it and certainly had nothing even resembling access. That number was now up to four, now including two of the last people Seto ever imagined allowing into the recesses of his private life. Still, times were desperate.

((Yea, I vaguely recall the gods/culture stuff I just kind of pushed it down as a sub-argument under what I had taken as his main argument - revenge for past wrongs and the death of ancestors. I guess because the latter is a better motive than the former (well, more the latter is easier to just run with than the former, which would take a lot more development than perhaps a single film could pull off). Poor Drax, he probably beats Rocket for me but that's about it. Though to be fair I don't feel latched to anyone at this time, though not in a way that bothers me like it did with Iron Man. Again the expectations thing probably plays a huge role.

I agree about Host Club going with a resolved yet not final ending being a good approach. I don't know if I'll mind too dark, it'll just probably depend more on what the manga does than how dark it is. I might watch Yami no Matsuei again, but not sure if I can bring myself to pick up an in progress series at the moment, as much as I would be interested in that one. Plus I don't want to fall into the same complication as with Loveless that if it does continue I will try to pick up where it left off but be confused because it's been too long. I still find rape/Stockholm Syndrome type motifs fascinating in literature (bad in real life), but I'm thinking maybe the reason I didn't get into it back then was that the characters were two one dimensional, I don't know. I actually have 6 volumes of it on my computer and pulling it up I see that I've only marked myself as having read the first chapter. So I either didn't get very far or stopped bookmarking. Maybe I'll give it another shot after Host Club. There's been series I've read the first chapter/volume of the first time and was like meh, yet later found myself very invested after digesting it a bit (like Fake). With this series where I'm not expecting to be frustrated, like with Yami no Matsuei I might be willing to give in progress a shot.))
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:41 pm


Jounouchi chuckled, "Don't worry, we wouldn't do that to you." he pat Kaiba's back for a moment, before seeming to catch himself being too friendly with the guy. He quickly put his hand back down.

((When paying closer attention to Ronan, I'd say that although the revenge thing was stated first, it wasn't really mentioned anymore after that, while the cultural and religious stuff was noted a few more times. Either way, I feel like they should've just went one way or the other and given it just a tad bit more development. Haha, I still like Drax though; he's cute.

Yeah, I definitely adore dark things, but not so much when it was something lighthearted that turned dark, unless it did so in a really thoughtful, effective way. I did a quick search on Yami no Matsuei and Okane ga Nai status. Looks like Yami no Matsuei is still in the same place as last I checked. Okane ga Nai had quite a long hiatus after volume 8, but has picked up again recently. I too am actually fascinated by rape/Stockholm Syndrome type things, but the thing with Okane ga Nai is it is definitely a love story. Rape is hardly acknowledged and Stockholm Syndrome aren't addressed at all. The story is essentially a story of a rape victim being held hostage by a man who is infatuated by him, and a number of people are aware of this situation and are friends with both of them, not taking it too seriously. And the victim is too afraid/uncertain to try to gain freedom, which would be fine as a character flaw, except the story is definitely going in the path of the victim falling for the captor and this being a completely good, natural thing. It is a story of Stockholm Syndrome that is pretending to be a basic love story. I like that kind of dark content, but I like it to be addressed as what it is, and not written in a way that makes the author and reader see it as a good thing. But I digress. Speaking of such topics, I started the manga 4Chan recommended yesterday and oh my god it is amazing. It is exactly about captor/victim and rape, but in a far darker, more real way. It doesn't make the rapist out to be this wonderful seme. He is legitimately insane and scary, and the victim goes through real struggles, trying to escape, then simply trying to survive and not give his captor the satisfaction of breaking him. It is a manga overall, but the prologue is written in novel form. I read the first five chapters and absolutely adored it. The art is fantastic, the characters all feel real. Even the side ones just seem like nice people doing their jobs. You not only sympathize with but also empathize with the victim, and he is an intelligent, confident, somewhat snobby gay man, but who doesn't by any means want to be with his captor. I liked it so much I want to buy it now, but it turns out it isn't a typical serialized manga. It's an independent project by two people who I believe are bilingual, as there are Japanese and English versions as original print, plus they have a team translating and printing it in a variety of other languages. They sell each chapter hardcover with beautiful art, but it's $12 each... It's also still ongoing, and there are well over ten chapters and side stories combined by now. I'm going to finish the chapters I was able to get ahold of for free, then decide from there how much I want to spend. It's so good though I'm honestly tempted to just start buying two a month. The website they are sold on is called Guilt Pleasure, and the creators say they specifically started the series because they wanted to make a higher quality yaoi series, in terms of art, story, and character development. Anyway, the series is called In These Words. If you want to give it a try, I'll see if I can find a link for the download I found, which has the first eight chapters as well as some side stories.))

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 4:07 am


Seto didn't flinch at the touch, finding it oddly comforting. 'Good,' Seto replied with a smile. 'So tasers and knives?' he asked, though it would probably be the best plan. A taser would be as effective at a distance as a gun without carrying the same legal ramifications. Of course, that really only applied if Hirutani truly was alone or with a small group that didn't vastly outnumber them. Still, Seto would have armed backup outside, and Jounouchi and Honda seemed to have no experience with anything else at the moment. They hardly had time for a training montage.

((Oh I don't side with the revenge argument because it was first, but because it's easily the better plot line and I guess I've felt charitable and decided to lean toward what works rather than what doesn't. I do like all the characters and Drax probably ended up amusing me the most (he was unexpectedly amusing whereas Star-Lord and Rocket were amusing as anticipated). I don't know if you watch Honest Trailers but the one from Winter Soldier yesterday amused the heck out of me. I think it's the first time they've actually pretty much stated we actually really love this movie and really we are only nitpicking because we are a comedy video and we can't do this without flaws. The flaws were fun but for the most part very nitpicky: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvHyk2ESFCI

Well I am hoping for thoughtful/effective with Host Club, I don't know anyone whose finished the manga so I properly only know it's darker (in part because I got somewhat into the darker post-anime stuff before stopping previously) without knowing anything spoilerish in terms of what will happen, so hoping for the best but curious either way. You really sold These Words (I was sitting there reading through the description the whole time thinking 'what is it called, what is it called!!') so I think I'm definitely going to go find that after Host Club and put of Okane ga Nai. I'd have to read it (the latter) to decide if it would honestly offend me because of how it plays those themes but atm all I remember is it didn't really draw me in and from what you say it seems to not be characterised well enough (in terms of how it's handling fairly serious themes). I do think rape type themes are fascinating but it is uncomfortable if a series tries to go about it in a lighthearted way.))
PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 2:03 pm


Jounouchi nodded, looking around, but not stupid enough to just run over and start touching things, "Are tasers easy to use? You think it's something we could just pick up right away?"

((Yeah, I prefer the revenge argument too. The cultural/religious one could be interesting... if it wasn't a space-fairing group of terrorists who go to all kinds of different planets. Oh well. Yeah, I did like how surprisingly funny Drax was. Gamora too. The other three you expected to be funny, and they definitely delivered. And yes, I had seen that honest trailer. XD I laughed when they just started defending it.

I have one friend who finished it and said it got awful because it was an overly dramatic love triangle with suddenly very whiny teenagers. But I'll still give it a shot eventually. And I know, I was just so blown away by it; it's definitely the highest quality yaoi series I've ever read. And I finished the chapters that were available to me and there was such a twist I couldn't believe it! It threw everything else on its head and completely changed the story line. And yes, it does have a story line, a surprisingly complex one. The rape porn is only a very significant part of it, but honestly the story wouldn't feel as deep and just... holy s**t without the graphic parts. It's a very quick read too, since it's only eight chapters and a couple bonus ones so far, not eight volumes. And yeah, it was one of those things with Okane ga Nai where I was at a point where I understood the way it was representing rape and captivity was wrong, but it didn't outright offend me. I was too fascinated by it. At the time I really hadn't found a good non-con series, just fanfiction, so it was an exciting find for me, and I had a friend who was really into it, so I had someone to fan over it with. Plus the main character was so similar to one of my originals I'd created for a roleplay I was very into at the time, so it was like having a series revolve around him all the sudden. XD I do actually like the characters in it (except the main seme). They are a bit flat and have some of the annoying tropes you often find in manga, but I still like them. My problem isn't their personalities or humanization; it's just the overall 'feel' of where the story is going that the author portrays. I really do need to give it another read and form a second opinion. I do remember near where I stopped reading they did an arc on drag queens and trans women working in the entertainment industry, and that was really progressively portrayed for Japan, and that made me happy. Okane ga Nai does seem too lighthearted for the scenarios it portrays, but it's not a full-out comedy or fluffy romance either. It definitely has its dark moments. I just wish it wouldn't make the rapist out to be a sympathetic character and have the side characters joke about the situation.))

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 3:27 pm


'Fairly,' Seto said, picking up one of the stun guns. 'It's not as precision based as a regular gun, and there is no real kick so it won't knock you over or anything. Although you'll want to aim the probes for the torso, you hit a limb - arm or leg - it'll only stun that limb. I've got mannequins in back, you can take a shot and see if you can handle it?' he asked, holding the gun out to Jounouchi.

((I now have a Google search for how to use a taser on my comp. xd

Yea, I think with as many characters and elements as they had to introduce it would have been too much to go for the cultural argument off the bat, especially with audiences - like, guiltily, myself - who aren't at all familiar with Guardians comic universe. I watched the video again after I mentioned it, still amused me to no end. xd

No, don't tell me it ends on a triangle I really want that to go away! That was already annoying where I left off around volume 12? So I hope it doesn't really end on that note though I don't mind drudging through it again as long as that's not where it cuts off. I hope to feel somewhat resolved, though I have to say when it comes to anime/manga I feel a lot of the series I've really liked have had disappointing ends. Though that probably goes for books to, endings are hard, I get it, but doesn't make it any less frustrating. I now have the beginning of These Words downloaded (thanks for that) so it's on my desktop, when I get through Host Club I'll give it a shot to see if it's my thing. Trying to find a good non-con series is probably why I really got into fanfic in the first place (unfortunately the good requires wading through a lot of bad). I will probably give Okane ga Nai a shot because it did seem like something I'd like, I don't think I'd mind a sympathetic rapist but side characters making some weird normalised joke about the situation might bother me. Guess we'll see.))
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