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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 12:37 pm
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:54 pm
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Sanguina Cruenta Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:07 pm
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 6:42 pm
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I think you're building up a false dichotomy here. Humans are still animals. We are still primates, but we are tool-using primates. Cities and modern technology are still natural things - they are organically a part of man's evolution. We adapt to change, or we die.
There is a difference between urban life and rural life, certainly, but they are both still natural environments.
As Sweet said, Wicca isn't really a "nature" religion. The Gods of Wicca are celestial in nature, rather than terrestrial. And I know Wiccans who haven't set foot outside of a city in years, and who are lost in a garden, and think of camping as torture.
Even so, Wicca's holidays follow the agricultural year, and focus specifically on fertility therein. While Wiccans can and do revere the signs of fertility we see reflected in the cycles of growth and renewal through the changing seasons of our year, it doesn't mean we're specifically worshiping the plants or trees or Earth. Wicca instead honours the forces that combine to make life possible, and the ways that they combine are sacred to Wiccans.
Balance is another of those things that Wicca's not really about. Polarity, certainly - but polarity doesn't exactly equal balance. Perfect balance is difficult to maintain, and unrealistic in many situations. Rather, forces tend to ebb and flow, cycling around each other and reaching equilibrium for only brief periods before the forces involved continue moving in their respective directions.
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 7:05 pm
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 7:47 pm
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 8:15 pm
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Lance Kibagari wiccan_sk8er I would go with Pagans, as Pagan tends to center more around nature than Wicca does. I happen to be a writer, and a Pagan, so I could write something up for ya if you want... Given that paganism is generally an umbrella term for any non-abrahamic religion, I fail to see how pagans are usually centered around nature. There are quite a lot of pagan religions out there, the majority of them having nothing to do whatsoever with the reverence or worship of nature.
Well, all the Pagan people I am acquainted with practically worship nature. I mean, it's not all about nature, but the majority yeah.. And if you do research on Wicca/Pagan, it clearly state's they are an "earth-bound/naturistic religion." i know you can't really trust anything you read online though, but that's what the majority says. I know that Paganism refers to any non-abrahamic religion, like Druid, Celtic, Wiccan, etc.. but when most people here the term Pagan, (or in my opinion) they usually imagine the modern-day "witch." Someone who believes in a male and female deity, does magick, performs rituals, etc.
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 8:25 pm
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wiccan_sk8er Well, all the Pagan people I am acquainted with practically worship nature. I mean, it's not all about nature, but the majority yeah.. And if you do research on Wicca/Pagan, it clearly state's they are an "earth-bound/naturistic religion." i know you can't really trust anything you read online though, but that's what the majority says. I know that Paganism refers to any non-abrahamic religion, like Druid, Celtic, Wiccan, etc.. but when most people here the term Pagan, (or in my opinion) they usually imagine the modern-day "witch." Someone who believes in a male and female deity, does magick, performs rituals, etc.
I don't think that's what most people imagine when they hear "Pagan" - and if they do then they're wrong, and should do more research. I mean if that's what people are thinking, then we as Pagans should do our best not to make that implication ourselves.
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Sanguina Cruenta Vice Captain
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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:06 pm
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wiccan_sk8er Well, all the Pagan people I am acquainted with practically worship nature. I mean, it's not all about nature, but the majority yeah.. And if you do research on Wicca/Pagan, it clearly state's they are an "earth-bound/naturistic religion." i know you can't really trust anything you read online though, but that's what the majority says. I know that Paganism refers to any non-abrahamic religion, like Druid, Celtic, Wiccan, etc.. but when most people here the term Pagan, (or in my opinion) they usually imagine the modern-day "witch." Someone who believes in a male and female deity, does magick, performs rituals, etc.
What you are describing is the eclectic neo-pagan movement of North America. It has a bad habit of assuming all pagans are exactly like them, and all do the same things or have the same beliefs - to the point where they project these things onto the term 'Paganism'. ENP in North America also has the unfortunate tendency to want to make everything soft, feel-good, unthreatening, and that everything is available to all who feel entitled to it. There's a whole lot of New-Age 'me' thinking involved, as well.
Quite often you find people in the 'Pagan community' speaking for all kinds of people and religions that they themselves are not properly members of - which rightly pisses those people off. Nothing like having someone misrepresent your religion on your behalf, unasked.
There are plenty of pagans, and pagan religions, who don't give a flying ******** about the great outdoors, or the state of the crops, or whether or not they can commune with trees or talk to rocks. Being a Pagan doesn't mean you automatically get issued a pair of Birkenstocks and some patchouli oil. 'Pagan doesn't equal 'hippie', or 'environmentalist', or even 'gardener'. It just means you're not a Jew, Christian, or Muslim. Liking nature (or having reverence for it) doesn't make something a nature religion, either.
Having seen your post in M&R, if you wonder why people on Gaia seem grumpy, it's because they post time and time again the same old things trying to clear up all sorts of misconceptions and misinformation that's built on people's assumptions. Frequently those assumptions are offensive to the people whose religions are misrepresented. It's frustrating.
It might be worth looking at your source materials, and perhaps find better ones, if you're under the impression that most paganism is nature worship, or eclectic neo-pagan. Read around a bit outside the Llewellyn shelf at your local Barnes and Noble. Broadening your horizons is always a worthwhile pursuit. Opinions are only worth what factual information they're built upon - it's worth making sure your foundations are solid.
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:45 am
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Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:16 pm
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wiccan_sk8er Lance Kibagari wiccan_sk8er I would go with Pagans, as Pagan tends to center more around nature than Wicca does. I happen to be a writer, and a Pagan, so I could write something up for ya if you want... Given that paganism is generally an umbrella term for any non-abrahamic religion, I fail to see how pagans are usually centered around nature. There are quite a lot of pagan religions out there, the majority of them having nothing to do whatsoever with the reverence or worship of nature. Well, all the Pagan people I am acquainted with practically worship nature. I mean, it's not all about nature, but the majority yeah.. And if you do research on Wicca/Pagan, it clearly state's they are an "earth-bound/naturistic religion." i know you can't really trust anything you read online though, but that's what the majority says. I know that Paganism refers to any non-abrahamic religion, like Druid, Celtic, Wiccan, etc.. but when most people here the term Pagan, (or in my opinion) they usually imagine the modern-day "witch." Someone who believes in a male and female deity, does magick, performs rituals, etc.
I don't worship nature (I have a lot of respect for it though). Also, I believe in multiple male and female deities.
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