We are nothing.

[PrezarioKaiser]

My aim here is going to be to make you feel as insignificant as I can. Sorry, it's nothing personal. But it's this idea I have. I'm having a hard time trying to put this idea into words; the way I've tried wording it still has holes and doesn't completely display what I'm trying to get across. I like to think I have a way with words, but it's not always so.

Ever heard of YTMND? Now you have. The YTMNDs I'm linking are going to essentially be slide shows with snappy music, but they get what I'm trying to say across better than I ever could. They're entertaining, either way.

The Size of Our World
It won't be long before this one breaks the bounds of how much you can fathom due to its lack of numbers. It's purely up to you to imagine it with what you're given.

A Tiny Glimpse
Unless you already knew all this, it just might blow your mind.

I could just be making a big deal out of nothing, so before I can express this idea of mine that could make me look insane, I need your input. How did you feel when you watched these? Was it overwhelming? Did you shrug it off? Can you simply shrug this off? All input is extremely valued.

*This is subject to heavy editing over the next few days. I managed to gather all this inside my very tired brain at 4:49 AM. Be gentle until tomorrow.*  

[SkeletonPhoenix]

so what we're really small. I don't think thats news to anyone. Go post this at a christian guild and see their reaction.

Christian: So what their alot of stars but that doesn't mean any of the planets are inhabited.

Me: burning_eyes rofl  

[Theophrastus]

I watched one of those a few months ago and was filled with awe, inspired to wonder. It's amazing the chance that produced me, and tells me all the more clearly to live every bit of this life with intense purpose to learn, enjoy and make an impression.

As to your original request, I can't really offer to help until you make it clear why you want to focus on human insignificance. Also, read some Heinlein, then some Lovecraft. biggrin  

[Kiyrugoji]

Wow, that was beautiful.  

[Rohkaze]

I think learning about the universe and our place in it is a wonderful experience. Sometimes I am filled with an ache because I doubt in my lifetime I will be able to see as many of the wonders of the universe as I would hope to, but also I am filled with a childlike exuberance. The universe is just a wonderful place to explore, to experiment, to learn, and to grow.

Now, the more we learn about the universe and our place in it as humans, we learn what an infinitesimally small fraction of the universe our existence makes up. But, that does not mean we are nothing or that our existence lacks in importance. To crawl down that nihilist hole does a terrible disservice to humanity and is more appropriate to the realm of superstition. It is an understandable feeling, that of being overwhelmed. But, I think if you roll with it and get excited about learning and discovery of existence and cosmology, you can replace the fear of insignificance with the wonder of knowledge and exploration.

One way to consider this is by taking a look at subatomic particles, such as quarks. They are much too small for us to see, and we only know about them by what we can observe of their effects on other things around them. But, without subatomic particles we have no atoms, without atoms we have no elements, and with no elements we have no molecules, and with molecules . . . well, on and on until you realize we would have no us without the very, very tiny subatomic particles. Small does not equal insignificant.

Now, if you are uncertain of what human significance is in the universe, perhaps you need to only look as far as the mirror. My life is significant simply because it is important to me. The sun may not blow up and the world end if I am not here, but my experiences, my thoughts, my daughter - all of this is dependent upon my being. I play a role in the shape and nature of our universe. So do you and every other person, even the theists (ugh . . . heh).

So, looking at planets and stars and the vast scope of the universe is not a reason to despair or feel a lack of importance. The universe is not a challenge to our existence; the universe supports our existence, and we are an inextricable part of our universe. The fact that we are seeing those planets and stars, the fact that we can look into the universe from our humble little planet, is an awful lot of validation of our existence, that we are here, that we are not diminished by the size of the universe, but are made greater by being part of something so grand.

Hope that answer had something of use in it for you.

All the best.  

[ProjectOmicron88]

Someone made a YTMND about Carl Sagan's "Pale Blue Dot" speech that I still love: http://palebluedot.ytmnd.com/  

[PrezarioKaiser]

ProjectOmicron88

Someone made a YTMND about Carl Sagan's "Pale Blue Dot" speech that I still love: http://palebluedot.ytmnd.com/

Ah, Pale Blue Dot! I knew I was forgetting something!

Also, Rohkaze, that was ******** beautiful. I couldn't have put it any better myself by any extent of the term. But perhaps I should have made myself a bit clearer. The name of this thread was more of a grab than an expression of what I'm trying to get across. Now that I'm more than half-conscious, let me elaborate.

The view Carl Sagan takes on this is much like my own. It's not our being that we should be viewing as insignificant, it's our problems, our prejudices, everything that's ever disheartened us. If only it were that easy. As long as people have something to argue about, they will. It's human nature.

This information is powerful stuff. The next time you argue something with someone, when it's your turn to retort, say something like "It's not like it matters. If the human race is as insignificant as it is, what chance do a single humans beliefs/opinions/issues stand?" When they ask you to elaborate, explain how vast the universe is, the inevitability of more intelligent species, and maybe, just maybe, they'll drop their issue and go on with whatever it is they enjoy. If they continue, well, then you have all the proof you need that they're not worth your time.

If I had to sum up everything I've been trying to say, it'd be do what you love, tolerate what you don't. If everyone were to follow these seemingly simplistic guidelines, the world would be a better place. Things like religion, racism, greed, they all just separate us further. But why get all bent up over something so seemingly insignificant when compared to the vastness of the universe? That's right. Because we're human. Humans, with numbers comprised of the intelligent, the stupid, the freethinking, the weak-minded; imperfection, to put it bluntly. The best you can do for yourself and others is do what you love, tolerate what you don't, and perhaps lesser beings that are seemingly incapable of following these steps will follow suite. An impossible perfect world? I'll drink to that.  

[Tenth Speed Writer]

Bravo, Rohkaze. That was beautiful indeed.



Personally... I find it almost comforting that we're so small, so insignificant in greater terms. I do, because the converse also means that we are an entire world, each of us, on much smaller terms.

Just as we mean everything to that as small as us, our dear sun Sol, though it gives life and motion to the worlds that surround it, means so little. Save for, perhaps, an eventual meeting with another star system, the life of our galaxy would live just as it would have had Sol never been.

And just the same... the milky way, as vast and astonishing as it is, could vanish in a quantum blink, and though this tiny corner of the universe would sorely miss it, the rest of existence would never even know that it wasn't there.

Looking smaller... a single atom can be all that holds together a molecule, but if it decays, and the molecule breaks apart, we would never take notice.



Even for all of this... meditating upon it proves only that it is pointless to meditate on it, and hence, to worry our minds with it. We exist and affect the world that we fit into. So it's always been, so it may always be.  

[PrezarioKaiser]

Tenth Speed Writer

Bravo, Rohkaze. That was beautiful indeed.



Personally... I find it almost comforting that we're so small, so insignificant in greater terms. I do, because the converse also means that we are an entire world, each of us, on much smaller terms.

Just as we mean everything to that as small as us, our dear sun Sol, though it gives life and motion to the worlds that surround it, means so little. Save for, perhaps, an eventual meeting with another star system, the life of our galaxy would live just as it would have had Sol never been.

And just the same... the milky way, as vast and astonishing as it is, could vanish in a quantum blink, and though this tiny corner of the universe would sorely miss it, the rest of existence would never even know that it wasn't there.

Looking smaller... a single atom can be all that holds together a molecule, but if it decays, and the molecule breaks apart, we would never take notice.



Even for all of this... meditating upon it proves only that it is pointless to meditate on it, and hence, to worry our minds with it. We exist and affect the world that we fit into. So it's always been, so it may always be.

Excellent point, I love what I've sparked in everyone. But I wouldn't go as far as to say that meditating on the idea is pointless. There's something alluring about pondering the physically imponderable. I say keep doing it, it's the ultimate means of stretching your limits of what you can comprehend.  

[AnonymouZ]

I haven't seen what those links are all about (didn't bring my headphones with me, so i'm not even gonna try to get it without listening to it,) but i get the feeling that you guys are talking about the sort of awe that you get when you watch the intro of the movie Contact. But whether or not i'm close or not, i'm gonna say: No way JOSE!

We may be very small by comparison to the universe*, but i do believe that even universal farts can have some impact on our lives. And by that i mean, it only took ONE Rosa Parks to start a freaking wide enough movement that impacted a whole country. It only took a country with a handful of rebels that made the world resist slavery**. It only takes a few molecules in your blood to make a part of your body realize it needs nourishment, and either give you a growl in the middle of the class, or will make your whole body intent on finishing that burger.

Similar to those dumb examples, i think it'd be the same with the universe. However small planet earth is. However insignificant in size is our galaxy... i am sure that the rest of the universe would somehow, someway feel it's absence. Not immediately... of course, but over the course of aeons, maybe, at some point... something or "someone" will be asking something like "So what ever the ******** happened to that milky way, anyway??"  

[Meirelle]

God, that's so beautiful. It can't be a coincidence that every person I've ever met with an interest in astronomy was either agnostic or an atheist. The humbling experiences you encounter with astronomy are just so... spiritual. It's like an epiphany. Suddenly your entire take on the universe is shattered. The nights when I look up at the stars have been some of the most profound spiritual experiences I've ever had. Just an intense feeling of oneness, union, fragility. And all this without God. Why would you ever need God for any spiritual epiphany when you can just look up at the stars?

I love the "Pale Blue Dot" speech. It sums my beliefs up in a nutshell. 3nodding  

[Cirosan]

When I first saw the Pale Blue Dot YTMND, I shed a tear in wonder whilst in the midst of an epiphany. And midway through it, as it began to address the nature of human aggression, I found myself murmuring, "What rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?"

Gazing up at the stars after that epiphany... No feeling can ever match that. It is sorrow and contentment, grief and acceptance all at once, and for a brief and fleeting moment, you feel at one with all that is and ever will be.

However, I must counteract everything zen I've said with a far more disturbing message: Idiots, for lack of a better term, have created knock-offs of the Pale Blue Dot YTMND to promote their own agendas. The most insulting of all of these is this one.

I feel compelled to bring that to your attention because I must remind everyone that we are not the only ones in more ways than one.

Besides, its good for a cheap laugh filled with pity for the ignorant.  

[Tenth Speed Writer]

Cirosan

When I first saw the Pale Blue Dot YTMND, I shed a tear in wonder whilst in the midst of an epiphany. And midway through it, as it began to address the nature of human aggression, I found myself murmuring, "What rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?"

Gazing up at the stars after that epiphany... No feeling can ever match that. It is sorrow and contentment, grief and acceptance all at once, and for a brief and fleeting moment, you feel at one with all that is and ever will be.

However, I must counteract everything zen I've said with a far more disturbing message: Idiots, for lack of a better term, have created knock-offs of the Pale Blue Dot YTMND to promote their own agendas. The most insulting of all of these is this one.

I feel compelled to bring that to your attention because I must remind everyone that we are not the only ones in more ways than one.

Besides, its good for a cheap laugh filled with pity for the ignorant.

Awe is awe. It makes as good a spiritual experience as it does an epiphany.  

[ProjectOmicron88]

Cirosan

When I first saw the Pale Blue Dot YTMND, I shed a tear in wonder whilst in the midst of an epiphany. And midway through it, as it began to address the nature of human aggression, I found myself murmuring, "What rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?"

Gazing up at the stars after that epiphany... No feeling can ever match that. It is sorrow and contentment, grief and acceptance all at once, and for a brief and fleeting moment, you feel at one with all that is and ever will be.

However, I must counteract everything zen I've said with a far more disturbing message: Idiots, for lack of a better term, have created knock-offs of the Pale Blue Dot YTMND to promote their own agendas. The most insulting of all of these is this one.

I feel compelled to bring that to your attention because I must remind everyone that we are not the only ones in more ways than one.

Besides, its good for a cheap laugh filled with pity for the ignorant.

1.) Earth is an ultimately inconsequential planet in a universe larger than any human being could comprehend with 100% of their brains.
2.) Therefore, God exists.

Ta-da!

Someone made one about Xenu, too. I think it deserves more respect because it's intentionally humorous.  

[Ammonia Spike]

ProjectOmicron88

Cirosan

When I first saw the Pale Blue Dot YTMND, I shed a tear in wonder whilst in the midst of an epiphany. And midway through it, as it began to address the nature of human aggression, I found myself murmuring, "What rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?"

Gazing up at the stars after that epiphany... No feeling can ever match that. It is sorrow and contentment, grief and acceptance all at once, and for a brief and fleeting moment, you feel at one with all that is and ever will be.

However, I must counteract everything zen I've said with a far more disturbing message: Idiots, for lack of a better term, have created knock-offs of the Pale Blue Dot YTMND to promote their own agendas. The most insulting of all of these is this one.

I feel compelled to bring that to your attention because I must remind everyone that we are not the only ones in more ways than one.

Besides, its good for a cheap laugh filled with pity for the ignorant.

1.) Earth is an ultimately inconsequential planet in a universe larger than any human being could comprehend with 100% of their brains.
2.) Therefore, God exists.

Ta-da!

Someone made one about Xenu, too. I think it deserves more respect because it's intentionally humorous.

That link made my day.