Good bye Sen. Spector

[James628]

The liberal republican Senator Spector finnaly Realized he was in the wrong party and went to were he could win the democrats. This on one hand give the dems 59 to 40 seats. but on the other the republicans are one step closer to becoming the conservative small goverment party again. since the late 90's when the party swung center right then center in 2000 and finnaly center left in early Bush years with a big goverment and fiscal recklesness more and more the party shrank, but now with the liberals figuring out the proper party to be in this could be a turn around for the once mighty GOP.  

[Lord Bitememan]

Quote:

but on the other the republicans are one step closer to becoming the small conservative party in goverment again.

Fixed your quote for you homes. Specter leaving is not a good thing. Pat Toomey is never going to win that seat and that becomes one more permanantly Democratic seat in the Senate. Conservatives had better wake up and realize that right now they've turned the GOP into a small southern regional party. You're not helped by driving the party so far to the right nobody will vote for it. Driving Specter out was just one symptom of the greater disease that has driven us to a 40 seat minority in government.  

[Twizzle Dizzle Red]

Lord Bitememan

Quote:

but on the other the republicans are one step closer to becoming the small conservative party in goverment again.

Fixed your quote for you homes. Specter leaving is not a good thing. Pat Toomey is never going to win that seat and that becomes one more permanantly Democratic seat in the Senate. Conservatives had better wake up and realize that right now they've turned the GOP into a small southern regional party. You're not helped by driving the party so far to the right nobody will vote for it. Driving Specter out was just one symptom of the greater disease that has driven us to a 40 seat minority in government.

I beg to differ. I for one am damned glad specter left as he does not represent the republican party. Good bye and I for one celebrated his leaving with a nice bottle of wine. He doesn't belong to the republican party as he does not share our values nor our principles. He doesn't stand for nor does he vote in the republican way.
He also realized that he would never win the republican seat back simply because he looked at the polls and he saw that his competition was far ahead of him. He lost his senority, and he lost the republicans. I say goodbye and good ridance. He wasn't there to represent us. He was there for idealogic reasons and the democrats are welcome to him. Specter is "comfortable" in his seat. He got used to living off the taxpayer and that is where he wants to remain.

I think pat toomy is much more suited to the party. The republicans have lost their way and need to come back to earth and start doing the job the republicans hired them to do in the first place. This has been a very good lesson for them. Maybe now they will grow the backbone needed to stand up to this faux and fraudulent liberalism who have decided to go against our constitution and against Americas people. They need to get back to what they truly stand for. I am very lucky. I have true republicans in my state. We are not suffering like a lot of the country is. That is because in my state we don't bend to big government and liberalism. Where do I live? In Oklahoma. Where 99% of the voters during the presidential election voted republican. I was also a delegate for Ron Paul. He is truly a wonderful man an Texas is very lucky to have him. You don't see that coming out of Specter nor out of John McCain. Yeah after all this big time spending a specters defection, I don't think the democrats want specter either. I really think toomy has a shot at it following the polls.  

[Lord Bitememan]

Quote:

Good bye and I for one celebrated his leaving with a nice bottle of wine.

You celebrated losing the filibuster with a bottle of wine eh? Did you throw a block party when we lost Congress in 2006 and host a nice little follow-up gathering when the presidency followed in 2008? Losing seats is not a good thing. If you don't grasp that basic fact you've got no business in politics. Ideological purity is the business of religions and cults, politics is about numbers. -1 is a bad thing when you play numbers.

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He doesn't stand for nor does he vote in the republican way.

http://www.acuratings.org/2008senate.htm

ACU gives him a 44.7 lifetime. That's better than every Democrat except Ben Nelson of Nebraska. The informative part is to look at his Democratic colleague from PA, Bob Casey, who registers an 8. In other words Specter was the most conservative senator you were going to get out of PA. This is the state that bounced Rick Santorum out by double digits.

Quote:

He also realized that he would never win the republican seat back simply because he looked at the polls and he saw that his competition was far ahead of him.

So what? The was largely the result of the out of state Club for Growth pushing Toomey and the greatly reduced conservative shell of what was once the GOP in PA liking that more. This has had a very poor record where they've done it. They kicked out moderate Republicans in MI and MD only to see their ultra-conservative candidates lose those districts to Democrats. That's not political success, it's a conservative jihad against heretics.

Quote:

He wasn't there to represent us.

You're right. He was there to represent Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania has very different concerns than Oklahoma. Don't think for a second that your representatives and senators don't take up issues that pertain solely to your state. Specter did a lot of the same, the only difference is he caught hell for it from the party.

Quote:

He was there for idealogic reasons and the democrats are welcome to him.

Actually, they're not. Specter has been as much a headache to the left as he has been to the right. He's already put the kibosh on card check and that seniority vote was largely influenced by opposition to other issues that he voiced.

Quote:

Specter is "comfortable" in his seat. He got used to living off the taxpayer and that is where he wants to remain.

Not unlike Richard Shelby.

Quote:

I think pat toomy is much more suited to the party.

He might be a good Senate candidate for South Carolina. He's crap for a state Obama carried by 10 points. Do you think a Nancy Pelosi style liberal would ever win a Senate seat in Alabama? Why would you think a Jim DeMint style Republican would win in a blue state?

Quote:

The republicans have lost their way and need to come back to earth and start doing the job the republicans hired them to do in the first place.

That will be fully irrelevant if the party isn't willing to tolerate broader ideological diversity. The party is not going to win by writing off the Northeast, Great Lakes Region, West Coast, and rely solely on the south and safer western states to carry them. That alone does not constitute a majority. Democrats learned a very hard lesson about writing off large swaths of the country and neglecting more moderate membership in favor of liberal orthodoxy. It cost them for years, and one of the keys to their success was embracing more moderate Democrats from the south and west. This strategy has won them two Senate seats out of Virginia, one out of North Carolina, and one out of Montana. Even Bob Casey, the Dem. from PA, is pro-life. The Blue Dog caucus in the house has swelled in the past two election cycles. At the same time the Republicans have lost nearly every Senator out of the northeast and the House delegations from that area are only in the single digits if you include New York. You need to reestablish the party in those areas to regain a majority. Period. You need moderates to do that. Period.

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Where do I live? In Oklahoma. Where 99% of the voters during the presidential election voted republican.

You don't study your own state's voting patterns very well. 35% of the voters in your state voted for Obama this election. That is the low point compared to 1996 when 40% voted for Clinton. Your state also couldn't get a Civil Rights Initiative (it bans Affirmative Action) on the ballot. Even Michigan got one of those on the ballot.

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I was also a delegate for Ron Paul.

I'm sorry to hear that. Admitting it is the first step in recovery.

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I really think toomy has a shot at it following the polls.

Quinnipiac would like to disagree. They conducted a poll of a statewide election with Specter as the Dem and Toomey as the Republican.

http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1327.xml?ReleaseID=1293

Yes, you read that correctly, Specter 53%, Toomey 33%. That's a stomping. It also means even as voters get to know Toomey, and some break in his favor, it is an exercise in futility because even if 100% of the undecideds broke in his favor, Specter still has 53%. The interesting part of that poll is that the moderate, Ridge, polled so well against Specter. That backs up the claim that you need a prominant moderate to beat Specter is this blue state, not a conservative.  

[Lord Bitememan]

If you want to see how the GOP should be reacting, James Forsyth penned a wonderful article on this:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/08/AR2009050802255.html

The amazing thing about Mr. Forsyth's article, is that it's nothing new. It's George W. Bush compassionate conservatism, which is itself just broad-based and inclusive Republicanism. Instead of woo-hooing when we have a smaller party, we should be cultivating broad-based policies and rhetoric that can keep a large coalition of voters and politicians together.  

[Twizzle Dizzle Red]

Lord Bitememan

Quote:

Good bye and I for one celebrated his leaving with a nice bottle of wine.

You celebrated losing the filibuster with a bottle of wine eh? Did you throw a block party when we lost Congress in 2006 and host a nice little follow-up gathering when the presidency followed in 2008? Losing seats is not a good thing. If you don't grasp that basic fact you've got no business in politics. Ideological purity is the business of religions and cults, politics is about numbers. -1 is a bad thing when you play numbers.

Quote:

He doesn't stand for nor does he vote in the republican way.

http://www.acuratings.org/2008senate.htm

ACU gives him a 44.7 lifetime. That's better than every Democrat except Ben Nelson of Nebraska. The informative part is to look at his Democratic colleague from PA, Bob Casey, who registers an 8. In other words Specter was the most conservative senator you were going to get out of PA. This is the state that bounced Rick Santorum out by double digits.

Quote:

He also realized that he would never win the republican seat back simply because he looked at the polls and he saw that his competition was far ahead of him.

So what? The was largely the result of the out of state Club for Growth pushing Toomey and the greatly reduced conservative shell of what was once the GOP in PA liking that more. This has had a very poor record where they've done it. They kicked out moderate Republicans in MI and MD only to see their ultra-conservative candidates lose those districts to Democrats. That's not political success, it's a conservative jihad against heretics.

Quote:

He wasn't there to represent us.

You're right. He was there to represent Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania has very different concerns than Oklahoma. Don't think for a second that your representatives and senators don't take up issues that pertain solely to your state. Specter did a lot of the same, the only difference is he caught hell for it from the party.

Quote:

He was there for idealogic reasons and the democrats are welcome to him.

Actually, they're not. Specter has been as much a headache to the left as he has been to the right. He's already put the kibosh on card check and that seniority vote was largely influenced by opposition to other issues that he voiced.

Quote:

Specter is "comfortable" in his seat. He got used to living off the taxpayer and that is where he wants to remain.

Not unlike Richard Shelby.

Quote:

I think pat toomy is much more suited to the party.

He might be a good Senate candidate for South Carolina. He's crap for a state Obama carried by 10 points. Do you think a Nancy Pelosi style liberal would ever win a Senate seat in Alabama? Why would you think a Jim DeMint style Republican would win in a blue state?

Quote:

The republicans have lost their way and need to come back to earth and start doing the job the republicans hired them to do in the first place.

That will be fully irrelevant if the party isn't willing to tolerate broader ideological diversity. The party is not going to win by writing off the Northeast, Great Lakes Region, West Coast, and rely solely on the south and safer western states to carry them. That alone does not constitute a majority. Democrats learned a very hard lesson about writing off large swaths of the country and neglecting more moderate membership in favor of liberal orthodoxy. It cost them for years, and one of the keys to their success was embracing more moderate Democrats from the south and west. This strategy has won them two Senate seats out of Virginia, one out of North Carolina, and one out of Montana. Even Bob Casey, the Dem. from PA, is pro-life. The Blue Dog caucus in the house has swelled in the past two election cycles. At the same time the Republicans have lost nearly every Senator out of the northeast and the House delegations from that area are only in the single digits if you include New York. You need to reestablish the party in those areas to regain a majority. Period. You need moderates to do that. Period.

Quote:

Where do I live? In Oklahoma. Where 99% of the voters during the presidential election voted republican.

You don't study your own state's voting patterns very well. 35% of the voters in your state voted for Obama this election. That is the low point compared to 1996 when 40% voted for Clinton. Your state also couldn't get a Civil Rights Initiative (it bans Affirmative Action) on the ballot. Even Michigan got one of those on the ballot.

Quote:

I was also a delegate for Ron Paul.

I'm sorry to hear that. Admitting it is the first step in recovery.

Quote:

I really think toomy has a shot at it following the polls.

Quinnipiac would like to disagree. They conducted a poll of a statewide election with Specter as the Dem and Toomey as the Republican.

http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1327.xml?ReleaseID=1293

Yes, you read that correctly, Specter 53%, Toomey 33%. That's a stomping. It also means even as voters get to know Toomey, and some break in his favor, it is an exercise in futility because even if 100% of the undecideds broke in his favor, Specter still has 53%. The interesting part of that poll is that the moderate, Ridge, polled so well against Specter. That backs up the claim that you need a prominant moderate to beat Specter is this blue state, not a conservative.

 

[Twizzle Dizzle Red]

Here's a true republican for ya

http://www.peacefreedomprosperity.com/?p=949

and btw he did very well in the state of pennsylvania  

[Twizzle Dizzle Red]

Lily Starr

Here's a true republican for ya

http://www.peacefreedomprosperity.com/?p=949

and btw he did very well in the state of pennsylvania

And in case you really have no idea about this game that washington DC is trying to control here is a letter I just recieved and its not a joke. There are some true patriots out here and we are doing something about this mess. Let the revolution continue

I don't like to use the word emergency but due to the time frame and importance of this matter, it is truly warranted for this historic event... please keep reading.

In 1910 a small group of bankers rode a private train in secret from New Jersey to Georgia to meet at a hotel known as the Jekyll Island Club. There they would conspire to take over America by forming the third Central Bank in US History. Flash forward 99 years, a small group of patriots from organizations across the republic will travel that same route by train and meet in the same room where the Federal Reserve was created to hatch the plan to undo the bankers plot and restore the republic.

An invitation came in the mail for me to attend this Jekyll Island meeting taking place and I must depart in 9 days. I am honored to accept the invitation to attend and contribute to the core discussion and provide direction with top leaders from the leading patriot organizations in the movement. People like G. Edward Griffin, Dr. Edwin Vieira, Ernest Hancock, Katherine Albrecht, Michael Badnarik and many more will be in attendance to put our heads together.

Although we would like to cover the event for Bob Schulz and the We the People Foundation, we will be providing exclusive independent media coverage through Freedom.TV and the Reality Report for Restore the Republic. Our crew will record different proceedings while the leaders and I do our best to draft a complete program to present to the delegates of the future Continental Congress.

In case you were unaware, the Continental Congress, organized by the We the People Foundation, will be bringing RTR and other groups together as a large consolidated group to form responses to the Governments repeated bad behavior at a later date. The Jekyll Island meeting is developing the program for it.

These are people who truly love their country and take their freedom very seriously. All are experts on the constitution. This is all goin on behind the scenes. Right now as I write this. So you can sit and squirm in you stupidly embarrassing think you know wisdom or you can get off your duff and help your country.  

[Twizzle Dizzle Red]

Lord Bitememan

If you want to see how the GOP should be reacting, James Forsyth penned a wonderful article on this:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/08/AR2009050802255.html

The amazing thing about Mr. Forsyth's article, is that it's nothing new. It's George W. Bush compassionate conservatism, which is itself just broad-based and inclusive Republicanism. Instead of woo-hooing when we have a smaller party, we should be cultivating broad-based policies and rhetoric that can keep a large coalition of voters and politicians together.

hmm strange but specter did this to himself:

Promoted?
On the "it couldn't happen to a more deserving fellow" front, Pennsylvania Sen. Arlen Specter, who recently outed himself as a Democrat, will lose his seniority on all the committees on which he serves. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) had promised Specter that he would retain seniority after switching parties, but as it turns out, most sitting Democrat Senators are unwilling to relinquish their chairs to the turncoat. Specter, who has previously touted his "clout" as reason for re-election and would have been senior to all but eight Democrats, will be the junior Democrat on three of his five committees -- except for the Crime and Drugs Subcommittee and the Special Committee on Aging, on which the 79-year-old, 28-year veteran will be next to last. --Patriot Post

Dumb thing to do huh?  

[James628]

Lord Bitememan

Quote:

but on the other the republicans are one step closer to becoming the small conservative party in goverment again.

Fixed your quote for you homes. Specter leaving is not a good thing. Pat Toomey is never going to win that seat and that becomes one more permanantly Democratic seat in the Senate. Conservatives had better wake up and realize that right now they've turned the GOP into a small southern regional party. You're not helped by driving the party so far to the right nobody will vote for it. Driving Specter out was just one symptom of the greater disease that has driven us to a 40 seat minority in government.

As the great Henery Clay once said "I would rather be right than be president" simply this means it is better to lose with your pricipals than to win prentending to be somthing your not. if the republicans become a conservative minorty then at least the partry is conservative.  

[Lexille]

i just love, love, love the fact that the democrats stripped him of pretty much everything (honor among thieves?)

shocked me, but it was great none the less...  

[Lord Bitememan]

James628

Lord Bitememan

Quote:

but on the other the republicans are one step closer to becoming the small conservative party in goverment again.

Fixed your quote for you homes. Specter leaving is not a good thing. Pat Toomey is never going to win that seat and that becomes one more permanantly Democratic seat in the Senate. Conservatives had better wake up and realize that right now they've turned the GOP into a small southern regional party. You're not helped by driving the party so far to the right nobody will vote for it. Driving Specter out was just one symptom of the greater disease that has driven us to a 40 seat minority in government.

As the great Henery Clay once said "I would rather be right than be president" simply this means it is better to lose with your pricipals than to win prentending to be somthing your not. if the republicans become a conservative minorty then at least the partry is conservative.

That's just bull-headed stupidity. You might as well go form a think tank, it will be about as useless as the party you intend to have. The path you intend to go down will do NOTHING to further your ideals. The only way to further your ideals is to obtain majority coalitions. This only happens when you compromise with those who don't see eye to eye with you. Your scorched earth attitude will only lead to a Democratic party that can amend the Constitution at will. You're killing your own cause. Your approach only works in multi-party systems like those in Europe, where you have more center-right parties who are willing to caucus with yours. You don't have that here. You have a two party system. Your way just grows the opposition and leads to the country becoming a place more and more unlike what you would like to see. It's stupidity pure and simple.

Lily: I'd respond to anything you said but nothing you said seemed to logically flow from this discussion not one damn thing. Lower the med doses and try again dear.  

[James628]

Lord Bitememan

James628

Lord Bitememan

Quote:

but on the other the republicans are one step closer to becoming the small conservative party in goverment again.

Fixed your quote for you homes. Specter leaving is not a good thing. Pat Toomey is never going to win that seat and that becomes one more permanantly Democratic seat in the Senate. Conservatives had better wake up and realize that right now they've turned the GOP into a small southern regional party. You're not helped by driving the party so far to the right nobody will vote for it. Driving Specter out was just one symptom of the greater disease that has driven us to a 40 seat minority in government.

As the great Henery Clay once said "I would rather be right than be president" simply this means it is better to lose with your pricipals than to win prentending to be somthing your not. if the republicans become a conservative minorty then at least the partry is conservative.

That's just bull-headed stupidity. You might as well go form a think tank, it will be about as useless as the party you intend to have. The path you intend to go down will do NOTHING to further your ideals. The only way to further your ideals is to obtain majority coalitions. This only happens when you compromise with those who don't see eye to eye with you. Your scorched earth attitude will only lead to a Democratic party that can amend the Constitution at will. You're killing your own cause. Your approach only works in multi-party systems like those in Europe, where you have more center-right parties who are willing to caucus with yours. You don't have that here. You have a two party system. Your way just grows the opposition and leads to the country becoming a place more and more unlike what you would like to see. It's stupidity pure and simple.

Lily: I'd respond to anything you said but nothing you said seemed to logically flow from this discussion not one damn thing. Lower the med doses and try again dear.

For most of the last eight years we had a majority coalition and oh yeah the party acted to liberal and got a good number of congressmen booted out of congress. It is good to be the majority but not when you betray your principals.  

[Lord Bitememan]

Quote:

For most of the last eight years we had a majority coalition and oh yeah the party acted to liberal

The party only acted "too liberal" if you consider the John Birch Society the political center. It is not, and in the past 8 years Congress cut taxes heavily, spent most of the money it spent on the military, and oh yeah, de-funded foreign agencies that provide abortion access abroad. The government was far from liberal for the past 8 years and only an ideological zealot would consider the past 8 years liberalism.

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and got a good number of congressmen booted out of congress.

Perceptions of being too liberal had nothing to do with congressmen losing elections. If you actually believe that check the back of your head, because that's where you will probably find the hole that your brains were scooped out through. Lincoln Chafee wasn't booted from Rhode Island because voters thought he wasn't conservative enough. Santorum wasn't kicked out in PA for not being conservative enough.

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It is good to be the majority but not when you betray your principals.

And it's useless to have a set of principles that precludes your from ever having a majority. The problem "true conservatives" have is that you don't get that your principles don't play for a majority of Americans. When you don't appeal to a majority of Americans, you won't get their votes, won't get into office, and won't see your ideals in any way shape or form become public policy. You will sit on the outside with a few reps and senators and the bulk of the political happenings will be on the real, actual left, not just this one invented of conservative hyperbole.

If you would rather have principles than win election, go vote for the Constitution Party. YOU are what's ruining the Republican party and you really belong with your ideological cohorts, not running the only opposition party in the country into the ground.